Non-Refundable Deposit - What are my consumer rights?

Zinger549

MalMonroe said:

societys_child said:

Don't know, have you spoken to them?

A bit mean, and not at all helpful.

The words pot, kettle spring to mind.

Jumblebumble

MalMonroe said:

Hi, this government document may help - 

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/cancelling-goods-or-services-guide-for-consumers/cancelling-goods-or-services#consumer-law-may-help-you

You do have rights, and as far as I'm aware, businesses aren't allowed to say "Under no circumstances is the deposit refundable".

The gov. document explains that any business can only charge disproportionate amounts if they are going to be unable to recoup any losses. 

I would think that with them having twelve months to resell the venue for a wedding, they'll manage that in no time at all.

In this case, the venue isn't going to lose out. 

If they're so popular, why not contact your local newspaper and see if they'd be interested in doing an article about this mean business if they refuse to play ball?

You may also be interested in information in the following link -

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/wedding-venues-advised-to-play-fair

It's from 2016 but still relevant.

Hmm
I have always wondered why airlines and hotels  can do exactly that unless the airline/hotel cancels the booking themselves

TELLIT01

If the OP accepts the £2300 refund as a first step, is there a risk that doing so could strengthen the argument of the venue that they have accepted all the T&C of the booking.

mattyprice4004

The problem is this is the point of a deposit - to stop flaky customers changing their mind and causing endless admin, advertising work and other faff. 
Always treat deposits as non-refundable unless specifically told otherwise - there's no point taking a deposit if people can just cancel willy nilly and demand all of the money back. 

Ask them nicely, but I fear you'll either have to let it go or go legal (which could go either way, if they prove their losses are £2k you'll have no refund and possibly be lumbered with their costs). 

ThumbRemote

Is there any possibility of holding the small and intimate wedding at the same venue? Perhaps in a smaller room, or with fewer guests? That way the venue may transfer the deposit you've paid towards the alternative plans. 

Ath_Wat

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head said:

Sandtree said:

weddingsos2023 said:

Thank you for your comments. 

I emailed them at the beginning of the week to go through some options as I didn't want to go in blazing demanding a deposit back I wanted to test the waters and go over some options and gather as much information as I possibly could before going for our deposit. 

The wedding & reception there is only £6448 and we paid £2000 deposit to secure the date and then have paid an additional £2300 on top of the £2000. 

They have said that they can return the £2300 and will do up until 9 months before and then it will decrease. 

I don't mind them keeping around £500 for 'administrate costs' - I just feel to keep the full £2000 when these 'terms and conditions' was never made clear to us upon payment, and even after a year of originally booking no contract has been signed with them to agree to these contractual conditions.  

A contract in England is formed when there is an offer, acceptance and consideration (aka payment). They offered to hire you the venue for £6,448, you accepted and then made consideration by way of the initial £2,000 payment and so a contract was formed. 

Deposits by their very nature are non-refundable by default else they are 99% pointless, the fact you chose not to ask questions about the T&Cs before binding the contract doesn't invalidate the fact a deposit isn't refundable. Next time read the contract before agreeing to it by paying... a signature is totally unnecessary in UK contract law but is just a handy form of proof. 

Don't under estimate the cost of readvertising the property... a quick look on Google Adwords and the estimate is £8.50 per click (that's click, not purchase) for "wedding venue Essex"... I'd be surprised if they get a 1% conversion rate from clicks and but if they did that means there is £850 of advertising fees before you even start getting into costs of showing people round the venue that dont then book, dealing with all the enquiries for dates that aren't available etc etc. £2k total does feel high but not necessarily ridiculously so. 

Is the deposit not just reassurance from the customer that they are serious about the contract and more likely to go ahead.

How is there any reassurance for the company that the customer is serious if the deposit is automatically refundable?

Ath_Wat

MalMonroe said:

societys_child said:

Don't know, have you spoken to them?

A bit mean, and not at all helpful.

Perhaps you should call ACAS or the local papers about it.  Those two courses of action are, after all, the sole answer to everything.

unholyangel

Sandtree said:

weddingsos2023 said:

Thank you for your comments. 

I emailed them at the beginning of the week to go through some options as I didn't want to go in blazing demanding a deposit back I wanted to test the waters and go over some options and gather as much information as I possibly could before going for our deposit. 

The wedding & reception there is only £6448 and we paid £2000 deposit to secure the date and then have paid an additional £2300 on top of the £2000. 

They have said that they can return the £2300 and will do up until 9 months before and then it will decrease. 

I don't mind them keeping around £500 for 'administrate costs' - I just feel to keep the full £2000 when these 'terms and conditions' was never made clear to us upon payment, and even after a year of originally booking no contract has been signed with them to agree to these contractual conditions.  

A contract in England is formed when there is an offer, acceptance and consideration (aka payment). They offered to hire you the venue for £6,448, you accepted and then made consideration by way of the initial £2,000 payment and so a contract was formed. 

Deposits by their very nature are non-refundable by default else they are 99% pointless, the fact you chose not to ask questions about the T&Cs before binding the contract doesn't invalidate the fact a deposit isn't refundable. Next time read the contract before agreeing to it by paying... a signature is totally unnecessary in UK contract law but is just a handy form of proof. 

Don't under estimate the cost of readvertising the property... a quick look on Google Adwords and the estimate is £8.50 per click (that's click, not purchase) for "wedding venue Essex"... I'd be surprised if they get a 1% conversion rate from clicks and but if they did that means there is £850 of advertising fees before you even start getting into costs of showing people round the venue that dont then book, dealing with all the enquiries for dates that aren't available etc etc. £2k total does feel high but not necessarily ridiculously so. 

I take it you haven't read the stickys? 
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/3073916/read-me-first-please-useful-links-resources-and-faqs/p2

The 5th post down, titled "is a deposit ever refundable?". It's a sticky because people kept being incorrectly told that deposits were non-refundable. 

A genuine deposit, which is a reservation fee and not an advance payment, can be legitimately kept. But, as explained in the CMA's unfair term guidance, it won't normally be more than a very small amount. Certainly not a third of the total contract price (which indicates it is not a deposit and instead is a prepayment/advance payment for services or goods).  

munchpot

weddingsos2023 said:

Wedding Cancellation/Amendment Policy

Under no circumstances is the deposit refundable. The following cancellation charges apply:

Date of Cancellation Cancellation charge payable by you

12 months before date of wedding £2000 deposit (non-refundable)

It's a long shot but couldn't you argue that if you gave them notice last week (or even tomorrow 11th July 2022) it's still more than 12 months away so you should get everything back.

Nothing above says 12 months + there's anything to pay and you would be 12 months + 3/365

Just a thought

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head

Ath_Wat said:

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head said:

Sandtree said:

weddingsos2023 said:

Thank you for your comments. 

I emailed them at the beginning of the week to go through some options as I didn't want to go in blazing demanding a deposit back I wanted to test the waters and go over some options and gather as much information as I possibly could before going for our deposit. 

The wedding & reception there is only £6448 and we paid £2000 deposit to secure the date and then have paid an additional £2300 on top of the £2000. 

They have said that they can return the £2300 and will do up until 9 months before and then it will decrease. 

I don't mind them keeping around £500 for 'administrate costs' - I just feel to keep the full £2000 when these 'terms and conditions' was never made clear to us upon payment, and even after a year of originally booking no contract has been signed with them to agree to these contractual conditions.  

A contract in England is formed when there is an offer, acceptance and consideration (aka payment). They offered to hire you the venue for £6,448, you accepted and then made consideration by way of the initial £2,000 payment and so a contract was formed. 

Deposits by their very nature are non-refundable by default else they are 99% pointless, the fact you chose not to ask questions about the T&Cs before binding the contract doesn't invalidate the fact a deposit isn't refundable. Next time read the contract before agreeing to it by paying... a signature is totally unnecessary in UK contract law but is just a handy form of proof. 

Don't under estimate the cost of readvertising the property... a quick look on Google Adwords and the estimate is £8.50 per click (that's click, not purchase) for "wedding venue Essex"... I'd be surprised if they get a 1% conversion rate from clicks and but if they did that means there is £850 of advertising fees before you even start getting into costs of showing people round the venue that dont then book, dealing with all the enquiries for dates that aren't available etc etc. £2k total does feel high but not necessarily ridiculously so. 

Is the deposit not just reassurance from the customer that they are serious about the contract and more likely to go ahead.

How is there any reassurance for the company that the customer is serious if the deposit is automatically refundable?

Have you deliberately selectively quoted my post to imply I said they should be refunded in full?

Or are you asking the what is the benefit of the trader taking an advance payment from which they can retain their losses in the event the contract doesn’t go ahead due to fault on the consumer’s part? The answer to which would be obvious.

Either way I don’t understand the point of your post?