appealing PCN through IAS (vs POPLA)

glybera27

Hello
I am in the processing appealing a PCN from CPM through the IAS service. I have had extensive experience of appealing through POPLA which was straightforwards , and I'd say 90% of PCNs were overturned. Judging from forums seems like IAS is a lot harder to get through. My back up for winning has always been POFA Act-2012 and saying I'm the keeper but do not know who the driver is. Will this work for IAS?

Do I just use the same technique as with POPLA? (as below)

Many Thanks 

1. CPM are agents for the owner/legal occupier lacking contractual authority/ lawful entitlement to demand money from the keeper for vehicles used in the car park. CPM must provide a full/ up-to-date/ signed+dated contract with the landowner (NOT just statements of an observed contract) giving CPM permission to pursue charges in THEIR name. I require the full unredacted copy i.e. not a document that simply claims a contract/agreement exists. 

2. CPM lack landowner authority. CPM must show a full unredacted IPC compliant contract with the landowner including: permission from the landowner to pursue charges, boundaries of land operated on, conditions/restrictions of parking enforcement, conditions of vehicles subject to control/enforcement, who has responsibility for signage & definition of services provided by each party.

3. No contract was entered into by CPM & the driver/ keeper. A legal contract involves agreement from both parties, clarity & certainty of terms. If not met the contract is deemed “unfair” (Unfair Terms in Consumer Contract Regulations 1999). I believe the driver did not got out of the car, read the signs, understood them & agreed to them (thus no contract was entered intro). 

4. The car was being used for drop off, I require CPM to provide proof that the car was not in fact using a Drop-off/pick-up zone during the visit. 

5. Signage was unclear, non-obvious, non-IAS-compliant leading to the driver being unaware a parking contract was being offered. 

6. CPM have not provided evidence to allow IAS to be confident they know who the driver/ person liable for the charge is. An insured driver can consensually drive another vehicle. I excise my right keep the driver anonymous. Where the charge is aimed at the driver, no other party can be told to pay (by POPLA, CPP or courts). See POFA Act-2012, Greenslade’s statement (2015) and case 6061796103 v Parking eye (Carly Law

Umkomaas

If the PPCs NtK is PoFA compliant (and most are these days) they have no need to identify the driver, they can hold the keeper liable. While some years ago 'old' POPLA might well have overturned a majority of PCNs, IAS are on record in stating they uphold 96% of PPC charges. 

glybera27

Thanks what's the best way to win the appeal in that case? Thanks 

Coupon-mad

You can't.

My back up for winning has always been POFA Act-2012 and saying I'm the keeper but do not know who the driver is. Will this work for IAS?
Do I just use the same technique as with POPLA? (as below).

No and no.

glybera27

What is the best course of action then? To pay it? Thanks 

KeithP

No-one has suggested that you pay it, and with your self-professed 'extensive experience' in these matters, I am surprised you mentioned it.  

The third option is not to bother appealing to the IAS and wait for you opportunity to win in the County Court.

Coupon-mad

Nowhere does this forum say pay it. There is a view that not trying IAS might make a case less likely to be picked/fast tracked for a court claim.

Maybe stay under the radar. Perhaps more likely to just do the rounds of the laughable debt letters.

In my experience you can't win at IAS so if it were me I wouldn't try and would just make sure I'd tell the scammers if you move house in the 6 years.

glybera27

Not an expert at all! Just copied an pasted the same spiel to POPLA in the past and largely seems to have worked. I was trying to work out if CPM cannot produce an unredacted contract with the landowner then how can IAS reject the appeal? (I've noticed few companies that have been able to do this within the appeal time frame). [I appreciate POPLA has a higher success rate]


regarding moving address, I am actually in the process of moving, what is the rationale of telling the company if I move? (and do I need to give them my new address)/ would they be able to get those details via DVLA ? Thank you. 

Coupon-mad

IAS don't want to see any landowner agreement.  You won't win with a POPLA template, so don't try.

what is the rationale of telling the company if I move? 

Wow.  I am glad I said that...do you want a default CCJ behind your back? They can't ask the DVLA again.  Haven't you seen all the default CCJ cases littering the forum?

KeithP

glybera27 said:

regarding moving address, I am actually in the process of moving, what is the rationale of telling the company if I move? (and do I need to give them my new address)/ would they be able to get those details via DVLA ? Thank you. 

If you are happy to hear from the Claimant some months down the line that you have Default County Court Judgment against you and now owe them £nnn simply because all correspondence went to your old address, then no you do not need to tell anyone that you have moved.

The advice here is to ensure that the parking company always has your current address to ensure that doesn't happen.

When you move, send the parking company's Data Protection Officer a Data Rectification Notice with details of your new address and instruct them to inform their agents too.

They cannot ask for your DVLA details a second time.

As an aside, remember that when you move you need to update the DVLA for all Driving Licences and all vehicle Registration Documents.

Fruitcake

I was lucky in my family member's case. I hade photo' evidence the car was not where the PPC said it was, and a copy of the landowner contract that proved the car was outside the area they were contracted to operate. We appealed to IAS and the PPC procrastinated for months before eventually cancelling the charge.

Unless you have some really good, killer appeal points, then I agree that an IAS appeal is not worth it. PPCs seem to think that a kangaroo court decision in their favour will convince a judge that they are a fine upstanding outfit, and the motorist most be at fault because an "independent" appeals process, honest your honour, supports the PPC's position.
Unfortunately, some judges fall for the scam. Consequently I believe C-m is right that a failed IAS appeal is more likely to provoke the PPC into making a court claim.