Finding out age of house

Section62

Michela said:

Why are you 'allowed' to do it if your house was built after 1948?

The houses opposite me were built after that date so can do it under PD but I can't.

I'm not overly bothered, just wondered what the thinking is.

It is largely arbitrary.  But don't confuse being "allowed to do it" with "allowed to do it under PD".

The latter just means not needing to make a full planning application rather than planning consent being deemed to be granted.

If you apply for planning consent it won't be refused solely because your house was built before 1948.

Michela

Section62 said:

Michela said:

Why are you 'allowed' to do it if your house was built after 1948?

The houses opposite me were built after that date so can do it under PD but I can't.

I'm not overly bothered, just wondered what the thinking is.

It is largely arbitrary.  But don't confuse being "allowed to do it" with "allowed to do it under PD".

The latter just means not needing to make a full planning application rather than planning consent being deemed to be granted.

If you apply for planning consent it won't be refused solely because your house was built before 1948.

Thanks. It was only that all the architects that have visited asked if we were built after that date and seemed to go in a different direction when I said I thought it was 1930's.

It was only one that went further to look at the OS maps. 

Btw I have not pinned down the architect yet, it's been a hard slog.

FreeBear

Section62 said:

Michela said:

Why are you 'allowed' to do it if your house was built after 1948?

The houses opposite me were built after that date so can do it under PD but I can't.

I'm not overly bothered, just wondered what the thinking is.

It is largely arbitrary.  But don't confuse being "allowed to do it" with "allowed to do it under PD".

The latter just means not needing to make a full planning application rather than planning consent being deemed to be granted.

If you apply for planning consent it won't be refused solely because your house was built before 1948.

if an Article 4 Direction has been made, PD rights will have been removed regardless of the date a property was built. In this situation, a planning application would need to be submitted. Even with a direction in place, permission may well still be granted.

Doozergirl

Michela said:

olbas_oil said:

Michela said:

Slinky said:

Is it possible to work out if the names relate to other properties in the road? It might be bad news, but if it turns out the 2 on either side of you were those named properties it might swing things your way?

I'm not how I would match them up as it says the name of the owner and the house name in 1933. But I'm not sure how to match them with exisitng numbers. It doesnt show any map it's just a small list of house names and owners. 

I also looked at the 1935 OS map and that says the road doesn't even exist. But it did according the 1933 register.

It may be worth looking at old phone books: British Phone Books, 1880-1984 | Ancestry®
If you can match a name of the owner, at some later date when the houses have been numbered, they may still be living there?

olbas_oil said:

Michela said:

Slinky said:

Is it possible to work out if the names relate to other properties in the road? It might be bad news, but if it turns out the 2 on either side of you were those named properties it might swing things your way?

I'm not how I would match them up as it says the name of the owner and the house name in 1933. But I'm not sure how to match them with exisitng numbers. It doesnt show any map it's just a small list of house names and owners. 

I also looked at the 1935 OS map and that says the road doesn't even exist. But it did according the 1933 register.

It may be worth looking at old phone books: British Phone Books, 1880-1984 | Ancestry®
If you can match a name of the owner, at some later date when the houses have been numbered, they may still be living there?

You are a genius, thank you. I took a guess and first time found the name from 1972 which matched with my house name in the 1939 register.

I also get to know what was house was originally called, so an added bonus.

So it was there in the 30's as I suspected. 

Doozergirl said:

Section62 said:

Michela said:

I have been advised that we can build up on our house if built after 1945.

What did they say the relevance of 1945 is?

1948 is the date used for working out certain aspects of permitted development - it is the basis of what the 'original house' was if it was built before then.

But I can't see an obvious reason why it would make a difference to whether or not you can do your project.

Is it something like the architect making assumptions about the foundations or structure depending on when it was built?

The new (and utterly ridiculous in many cases) ability to build additional storeys under PD.  

https://www.planningportal.co.uk/permission/common-projects/additional-storeys-extending-upwards/planning-permission

Why are you 'allowed' to do it if your house was built after 1948?

The houses opposite me were built after that date so can do it under PD but I can't.

I'm not overly bothered, just wondered what the thinking is.

I think it is about the character of properties and trying to maintain it.  

I think it's a terrible addition to permitted development rights at all, personally. 

Michela

Doozergirl said:

Michela said:

olbas_oil said:

Michela said:

Slinky said:

Is it possible to work out if the names relate to other properties in the road? It might be bad news, but if it turns out the 2 on either side of you were those named properties it might swing things your way?

I'm not how I would match them up as it says the name of the owner and the house name in 1933. But I'm not sure how to match them with exisitng numbers. It doesnt show any map it's just a small list of house names and owners. 

I also looked at the 1935 OS map and that says the road doesn't even exist. But it did according the 1933 register.

It may be worth looking at old phone books: British Phone Books, 1880-1984 | Ancestry®
If you can match a name of the owner, at some later date when the houses have been numbered, they may still be living there?

olbas_oil said:

Michela said:

Slinky said:

Is it possible to work out if the names relate to other properties in the road? It might be bad news, but if it turns out the 2 on either side of you were those named properties it might swing things your way?

I'm not how I would match them up as it says the name of the owner and the house name in 1933. But I'm not sure how to match them with exisitng numbers. It doesnt show any map it's just a small list of house names and owners. 

I also looked at the 1935 OS map and that says the road doesn't even exist. But it did according the 1933 register.

It may be worth looking at old phone books: British Phone Books, 1880-1984 | Ancestry®
If you can match a name of the owner, at some later date when the houses have been numbered, they may still be living there?

You are a genius, thank you. I took a guess and first time found the name from 1972 which matched with my house name in the 1939 register.

I also get to know what was house was originally called, so an added bonus.

So it was there in the 30's as I suspected. 

Doozergirl said:

Section62 said:

Michela said:

I have been advised that we can build up on our house if built after 1945.

What did they say the relevance of 1945 is?

1948 is the date used for working out certain aspects of permitted development - it is the basis of what the 'original house' was if it was built before then.

But I can't see an obvious reason why it would make a difference to whether or not you can do your project.

Is it something like the architect making assumptions about the foundations or structure depending on when it was built?

The new (and utterly ridiculous in many cases) ability to build additional storeys under PD.  

https://www.planningportal.co.uk/permission/common-projects/additional-storeys-extending-upwards/planning-permission

Why are you 'allowed' to do it if your house was built after 1948?

The houses opposite me were built after that date so can do it under PD but I can't.

I'm not overly bothered, just wondered what the thinking is.

I think it is about the character of properties and trying to maintain it.  

I think it's a terrible addition to permitted development rights at all, personally. 

That makes sense but some have been done it and their 1930's bungalows transformed. I actually don't like the look of them, too modern, white rendered exterior and grey modern tiles, looks like a lego building.  So although I want to extend I would like to balance it more.   

Ian_Gracie

For what it's worth, I was a planning officer for a number of years so might be able to help.

All the info you have received here is great and the idea of finding the house name was great! For the purposes of getting your additional storey the difference between it being under PD or having to apply for planning permission isn't massive other than probably the length of time it takes to get the consent.  Even if it was allowed under PD its likely that it would need 'prior approval' which is essentially a paired back version of planning permission but keeps strict time constraints and restricts the assessment to amenity and design.  i.e. you'd still need to apply and it would be assessed.

In terms of the architect, if you're struggling to pin them down, I'd have a look on your Council's website for similar types of development in your area.  Take a look at the drawings and see who drew them.  If it was granted consent recently then you have evidence of someone who works in the local area and has worked with that Council before who will be much more confident and intelligent about how they approach the Council with certain designs.

Hope it helps.

Doozergirl

Michela said:

Doozergirl said:

Michela said:

olbas_oil said:

Michela said:

Slinky said:

Is it possible to work out if the names relate to other properties in the road? It might be bad news, but if it turns out the 2 on either side of you were those named properties it might swing things your way?

I'm not how I would match them up as it says the name of the owner and the house name in 1933. But I'm not sure how to match them with exisitng numbers. It doesnt show any map it's just a small list of house names and owners. 

I also looked at the 1935 OS map and that says the road doesn't even exist. But it did according the 1933 register.

It may be worth looking at old phone books: British Phone Books, 1880-1984 | Ancestry®
If you can match a name of the owner, at some later date when the houses have been numbered, they may still be living there?

olbas_oil said:

Michela said:

Slinky said:

Is it possible to work out if the names relate to other properties in the road? It might be bad news, but if it turns out the 2 on either side of you were those named properties it might swing things your way?

I'm not how I would match them up as it says the name of the owner and the house name in 1933. But I'm not sure how to match them with exisitng numbers. It doesnt show any map it's just a small list of house names and owners. 

I also looked at the 1935 OS map and that says the road doesn't even exist. But it did according the 1933 register.

It may be worth looking at old phone books: British Phone Books, 1880-1984 | Ancestry®
If you can match a name of the owner, at some later date when the houses have been numbered, they may still be living there?

You are a genius, thank you. I took a guess and first time found the name from 1972 which matched with my house name in the 1939 register.

I also get to know what was house was originally called, so an added bonus.

So it was there in the 30's as I suspected. 

Doozergirl said:

Section62 said:

Michela said:

I have been advised that we can build up on our house if built after 1945.

What did they say the relevance of 1945 is?

1948 is the date used for working out certain aspects of permitted development - it is the basis of what the 'original house' was if it was built before then.

But I can't see an obvious reason why it would make a difference to whether or not you can do your project.

Is it something like the architect making assumptions about the foundations or structure depending on when it was built?

The new (and utterly ridiculous in many cases) ability to build additional storeys under PD.  

https://www.planningportal.co.uk/permission/common-projects/additional-storeys-extending-upwards/planning-permission

Why are you 'allowed' to do it if your house was built after 1948?

The houses opposite me were built after that date so can do it under PD but I can't.

I'm not overly bothered, just wondered what the thinking is.

I think it is about the character of properties and trying to maintain it.  

I think it's a terrible addition to permitted development rights at all, personally. 

That makes sense but some have been done it and their 1930's bungalows transformed. I actually don't like the look of them, too modern, white rendered exterior and grey modern tiles, looks like a lego building.  So although I want to extend I would like to balance it more.   

It's not so much about doing it, it is about what it looks like with a bungalow conversion.  

But imagine a semi detached pair of house and one decides to extend upward by a floor - and for that to be permitted development with the local authority having no say on what it looks like?  That is ridiculous.