Civil Enforcement Ltd - DCBL - Notice of Debt Recovery

DoffDoff

Hi all,

Yesterday I received a letter from DCBL (Limited, not legal) stating that I owe an overdue amount of £288.56 which is due to CEL and it's in relation to a CCJ of which they provided a CCJ number - see below. 

First thing I want to mention is that I did initially try to contact DCBL before visiting this site, however I did not speak with anyone as I was placed in a queue at position 79! Secondly I have requested a SAR from the DPO at CEL. This wasn't easy, as the DCBL letter does not tell me the date of the incident or the vehicle it relates to. I requested as much as I could and gave them potential registration numbers. Awaiting response on that. 

I have not received any letters, emails or any type of correspondence prior to this letter from DCBL or CEL. DCBL obviously have my correct address, so can only assume CEL would have had the same? 

It's an extremely random amount and one I'm not familiar with. I am not aware of any parking fines (that I can remember). I am certainly not aware of ever having a CCJ. I signed up with Experian and couldn't see any CCJ's within my report. I also searched for the CCJ number provided and couldn't find anything on the registry trust online system. 

Am I being had here? 

The letter states that 'this case is not subject to high court or bailiff action' and I will take the advice I have read and ignore them. But I'm extremely curious as to whether this is real... could I have had a CCJ I was never aware of? Any advice here greatly appreciated.

Thanks. 

DoffDoff

DCBL Letter

Coupon-mad

Try Trust Online.  You have a CCJ.

And ring the CCBC in Northampton to ask for a copy of the claim particulars and calculation of fees, and which address it was sent to.

This is what CEL are doing now, hoovering up money from claims they filed to old addresses years ago.

Loads of CEL threads like this, even one today.  There is a particular search to do, as already posted earlier,

DoffDoff

@Coupon-mad thanks for your response.

As mentioned in my post, using the CCJ number provided on the letter I did search 'trust online' and it didn't bring up any results. You say I 'have a CCJ' but surely it would show up on my credit file if I did? 

I'll take your advice and contact CCBC tomorrow first thing.  

Coupon-mad

I think you do.  Does the DCBLtd letter give a claim number?  

See what CCBC say

DoffDoff

@Coupon-mad the letter references a CCJ number which is 8 characters (I blocked it from the screenshot above). Within the trust online search I have used the 'check a case number' function but when I enter the CCJ number I get the following: 

'Case number invalid or not found on the public Register'

It may be that I had a CCJ over 6 years ago and it has since been wiped, but one that I was unaware of and I have had no problem obtaining credit of any kind for years! This would also suggest that the supposed amount due is extremely old... tells me these companies are a little desperate!  

Coupon-mad

Claim numbers are 8 characters.  I don't think it's over 6 years ago.  We've seen cases like this before where the CCJ doesn't show up but does exist.

DoffDoff

@Coupon-mad I spoke with CCBC this morning and they were very helpful. 

I provided them with the claim number and they could see a judgement on their system but declared it as invalid. They referred to it as 'the case is stayed' which is why I don't currently have a CCJ against me. 

It is in relation to a private parking charge on 01/12/2018. Unfortunately they had no further details regarding particulars other than a PCN number/ref, as CEL had told them that the particulars of claim were being sent to me separately. What I do know is that they apparently issued the claim on 19/11/2019 and this went to one of my previous addresses (I have since moved from this address 2 times). 

CEL had tried to enter judgement but couldn't due to the length of time. On the 14/01/2020 they had sent 'certificate' to court (not sure what else is entailed here), and then on 15/06/2020 CCBC had put a 'stay' on the case. CEL had then requested judgement on 18/06/2020 but were obviously 3 days late! 

These are the actions CCBC have advised:

- Contact CEL directly (legal@ce-service.co.uk/08709195577) and write to them directly too
- This contact would firstly be to ascertain whether I agree with the parking charge as currently I don't know any of the details. I have submitted request for a SAR which may also help with this. 
- If I agree, CCBC think I should negotiate the sum of £288.56 to a lower amount by stating that the claim issue was sent to a very old address. They have also said CEL would need to send in application to 'lift the stay' which would cost them £108 to do, and has a 6-8 week turnaround. 
- If I did agree to pay, CEL would need to send a letter to CCBC confirming payment in full as it does not get updated on their system automatically. 
- If I do not agree with the parking charge, CCBC said I can send a defence in. 

I'd really like to get yours/others thoughts/advice on this. I have done a lot of reading and this isn't the same advice I have seen, but also looks to be a bit of a unique scenario. 

Thank you. 

  

BobsBurgerss

Hi @DoffDoff

This is the exact situation I am in (identical letter, amount and advice given to me by CCBC although you have more detail). I called the local County Court and they confirmed there was no CCJ, that no judgement has passed and there isn’t one on my credit checks. They referred me to the Northampton CCBC and first they advised me to complete a N244 form but I called them back as this had a fee to pay and on the second call I was advised to file a defence. 

After reading the Newbie posts over the last two days stressing about this, I’m going to complain to the car park owner (mine is for an overstay and I’ve known the owners for 30 years so hope they will cancel this?) and I’m putting a SAR in to CEL. 

Stupidly I did call DCB Ltd as I was panicking regarding the CCJ and I did give them my email. They told me I had no choice but to pay and it has been so long now, that paying is the final option, that I do have a CCJ and it will show as satisfied as soon as I pay. I very nearly paid for this but decided to call the EAP service where I work and created an MSE account for advice!

Coupon-mad

Wow.  CEL are sending stayed cases to bailiffs who are wrongly telling people they have a CCJ.

This is new and alarming. And unlawful.

Neither of you should pay a penny nor be told to negotiate with this awful firm.

IANAL but here are my thoughts.

I think, because the claim was never served (due to wrong address) and was stayed, you could both email a defence to CCBC now so that you 'win the race' such that even if CEL apply to lift the stay, once alerted, they can't then enforce judgment because your defence has beaten them to it and the case progresses as normal.

And you'd have no CCJ and can then win the case, by following the usual steps for court claims (WS and evidence).

You do both need a SAR but no need to wait for that to come back.  A defence can be done using the forum Template Defence with para 3 saying you were never served with Particulars of Claim and know nothing about the case at all.

Another alternative though, for discussion:

...is to email the CCBC a signed statement attaching the DCBLtd letter, stating that you believe that Scott Wilson, head of legal at Civil Enforcement Ltd, may have a case to answer for contempt of court, for sending in bailiffs for stayed cases. You know of at least one other so this is a pattern and no doubt there are more like this and many people will have just paid up (you two might want to help each other by pm to mirror your approaches).

Also tell the CCBC to erase your old address data and note your new address instead, in case of any future movement on the claim.

But you require this note to be placed with the file, in order to alert any Judge dealing with a future application to lift the stay, that you were never served.  Applying the authority of Boxwood v Gleeson here:

https://www.lpc-law.co.uk/news/case-summary-of-boxwood-v-gleeson/

...there can be no relief from sanctions (a dead claim cannot be resurrected) where neither the claim nor full particulars were ever served.  The claim must be struck out.

..................................

I'm not sure whether plan A (lodge a defence) or plan B (as above) is best, or something else entirely, so see what @Johnersh (a solicitor poster) or @bargepole (a legally qualified parking law expert poster) say.  Maybe they have a better way forward.

Either way I think you will be telling DCBLtd to go swivel - but wait till you have a plan to put something on file with the CCBC first, to win the race and prevent a lifting of the stay.

bargepole

I don't think filing a Defence is the right way to go. That will result in the CCBC lifting the stay, and transferring the case to the local court for allocation and directions.

Plan B above seems a better bet, that way you will be aware of any future correspondence sent to your current address.