Advice on ending tenancy

Mimi123456

Thank you NQManchester and Slithery.

I cancelled my standing order for now. Will see what the week brings. 

I sent them an email asking to add the clarification in the extension addendum about the times and days of viewings. Hopefully their desire to get the keys asap will overweigh their need to be difficult to me. 

NQManchester

Slithery said:

NQManchester said:

I won’t add to the excellent advice other than to suggest that if you’re paying by direct debit to make sure you cancel it before the next rent payment and do your own bank transfer.

If they do agree an early surrender and you accidentally overpay it’ll probably be a lot of hassle getting the overpayment back going off their current behaviour.

Not true. You can ask your bank to reclaim any direct debit at any time and they'll do it without even asking the recipient - it's part of the 'direct-debit guarantee'.

This is why we advise LL's to not take direct debits but insist in a standing order instead as these can't be reclaimed. There have been a few cases on here where dodgy tenants have left a property and then claimed back years worth of rent from their DD payments before emptying and closing their bank account and then going AWOL.

Wish I’d known that! Thanks. Although I will then amend my advice to cancel your standing order if you have one 😂

PRAISETHESUN

There's no real advantage to cancelling a standing order in my mind. It just means you need to pay your rent manually - you still retain control in either case whether you pay by SO or FP. The advice to cancel a direct debit however is a good one, assuming the LL was silly enough to accept it in the first place. In this case the control is with the LL, although protections such as the DD guarantee mean in that practice if they did take payment then you could claw it back fairly easily. None of that means you are not obligated to pay however, as the TA makes is very clear how much rent is due, and when it is due by. If you didn't pay I believe the LL could apply for accelerated repossession if the arrears are enough, and could also take you to court to claim for the money owed.

I'd personally just plan to serve notice on the 14th (or whatever the applicable date is) and then you can separately agree a mutual surrender if you like. In any case, make sure to get everything in writing and don't sign/agree to anything you don't agree with.

Mimi123456

Hello everyone. A quick update from me.

After two days of backwards and forwards we signed an extension. I will spare you all the detail of how with every update of the document they tried to ‘lose’ or ‘forget’ one of the T&Cs on viewings, dropping either ‘Monday to Friday’ or 9-5 or prior notice  🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄

Now they are attacking on a different front. Trying to schedule checkout and inventory check on the last day of tenancy, which is the day I’m moving and cleaning. So clearly won’t be able to give them the key at 11am or smth. 🤦🏻‍♀️🤦🏻‍♀️🤦🏻‍♀️🤦🏻‍♀️

Clearly their ‘clever’ plan is to charge me ‘call-out fee’ for not being ready when they show up in the morning and I’m packing. 

I expect the 3rd front of the battle will likely also be problems with my deposit. 😟 already prepping myself for being blamed for every little bit of dust

PRAISETHESUN

Mimi123456 said:

Hello everyone. A quick update from me.

After two days of backwards and forwards we signed an extension. I will spare you all the detail of how with every update of the document they tried to ‘lose’ or ‘forget’ one of the T&Cs on viewings, dropping either ‘Monday to Friday’ or 9-5 or prior notice  🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄

Now they are attacking on a different front. Trying to schedule checkout and inventory check on the last day of tenancy, which is the day I’m moving and cleaning. So clearly won’t be able to give them the key at 11am or smth. 🤦🏻‍♀️🤦🏻‍♀️🤦🏻‍♀️🤦🏻‍♀️

Clearly their ‘clever’ plan is to charge me ‘call-out fee’ for not being ready when they show up in the morning and I’m packing. 

I expect the 3rd front of the battle will likely also be problems with my deposit. 😟 already prepping myself for being blamed for every little bit of dust

I could be wrong on this, but I believe you have up until midnight on your final day to return the keys, however practically it's probably in your interest to return the keys at the same time as the check out inspection (assuming this takes place on your final day), given you anticipate problems. You don't want them to try and claim you're responsible for any damage caused between when you returned and the keys and whenever they get around to doing an inspection.

What did the agreement you signed say about returning the keys? (this takes precedent and you should stick to that). I don't believe they can charge fees unless they have legitimately incurred costs by you not being ready to move out at the mutually agreed time. In any case, I'd personally aim to have everything ready ahead of move-out day if possible to avoid this. You can start packing things now that you're not going to need until you move out.

I'd also highly recommend you conduct your own thorough check out report, with photos, and provide this to your agent/LL when you return the keys. They can conduct their own check out if they wish. A bit of dust is fine, but cleaning is often a big source of conflict. As long as the property is in the same condition as when you moved it (minus fair wear and tear) then you'll be okay. Any discrepancies/disputes/unfair deductions, then you can take this up with your deposit protection scheme.

caprikid1

"Now they are attacking on a different front. Trying to schedule checkout and inventory check on the last day of tenancy, which is the day I’m moving and cleaning. So clearly won’t be able to give them the key at 11am or smth. 🤦🏻‍♀️🤦🏻‍♀️🤦🏻‍♀️🤦🏻‍♀️"

Not sure if this is attacking, surely it makes sense from your perspective to have the checkout completed and signed off when it's still your place with no gaps in between for things to get damaged and broken.

I would certainly be looking to be out before the last day so I could do a thorough check and clean. 

Mimi123456

They now booked the inventory check for 9.30am on 31st.

my movers are not even coming that early.

what do I do?

I said to the EA this is my moving date and asked if it can be organised for the afternoon. They obviously ignored it on purpose. 

I take it as deliberate aggression on their side. Not sure how to respond 😣 I physically won’t be able to vacate by then.

Mimi123456

So basically I’m being set up. 😟

For either a call-out fee for the inventory check firm. They will charge a fee if they arrive and property is not ready for inspection.
or else they are trying to not give me time to clean the place and planning to take a cut of my deposit. 

is there anything I can do to defend myself here? Any specific wording in the email that I can present in deposit dispute situation?

I think it is really unreasonable to assume I should be out before 9.30am as technically it’s still my last day of tenancy and I’m paying rent for it.

MaryNB

Mimi123456 said:

So basically I’m being set up. 😟

For either a call-out fee for the inventory check firm. They will charge a fee if they arrive and property is not ready for inspection.
or else they are trying to not give me time to clean the place and planning to take a cut of my deposit. 

is there anything I can do to defend myself here? Any specific wording in the email that I can present in deposit dispute situation?

I think it is really unreasonable to assume I should be out before 9.30am as technically it’s still my last day of tenancy and I’m paying rent for it.

They cannot take any money off as long as it is left as clean as it was when you moved in. Take time stamped photos of everything before you move out (and I hope you did the same when you moved in). 
 
If they try to claim for something unreasonable, claim your deposit straight back from the scheme where it is protected. If the letting agent does try to claim it wasn't clean make it clear to the DPS that that the property was still in your possession and you have time stamped photos taken just before you surrendered the keys. 

I presume no time is specified in your AST. Just email and inform them you will not be moving out at 9:30am, your tenancy applies for the full day, and the property will not be available for an inspection until a specified time. Shelter says the appointment should be at a convenient time and I don't think 9:30 is reasonable. Moving takes time and it's not like lettings agencies close early on Thursdays.

Remind them that a check out fee is a prohibited payment under the Tenant Fees Act 2019.

They can only charge you a contractual damage if they incur a loss as a result of your breach but if they decide on 09:30 and you say the property is not available until a later time I don't know how they could justify it. You are still legally a tenant and will allow them to access at a time that is convenient to you. It's more than three weeks away, plenty of time for them to rearrange the checkout. 

canaldumidi

Mimi123456 said:

They now booked the inventory check for 9.30am on 31st.

my movers are not even coming that early.

what do I do?

I said to the EA this is my moving date and asked if it can be organised for the afternoon. They obviously ignored it on purpose. 

I take it as deliberate aggression on their side. Not sure how to respond 😣 I physically won’t be able to vacate by then.

Dear Mr Agent,

Thank you for letting me know of the inventory check you have booked for 9.30 on the 31st.

Please be aware that the property will be in a mess at that time as I will not have moved out by then. I remind you that the tenancy will not have ended. There will be boxes everywhere and I will not have done a final vaccum etc, therefore your condition report will be of little value.

I'll be happy to forward you my own photos once I've vacated at the end of the tenancy, which will be of far more relevance to you than any taken at 9.30 AM.

Yours sincerely,

Mimi

(that should show the deposit scheme arbitrators how irrelevant the agent's inventory report is if/when the deposit goes to dispute!)