Wet electric heating, economy 7 nightmare

MWT

bunny73 said:

... and two meters on standing charge of 35p each a day. 

Gerry1 said:

●  You should be paying only one standing charge.  Victory: 2 MPANs but one SC

Gerry has a good point here though, on E7 you should have only one meter, can you give us a photo of the meters please?

If one is for day and the other for night I am wondering if your 'day' rate is  actually still accumulating through the night as well and the 'night' meter is only recording your hot water heating... ?

Gerry1

The two meters and the two standing charges suggest that it may once have been THTC or some other weird legacy tariff and that it may not now be genuine E7.  It might also help to explain the very high kWh rates.

MWT

Gerry1 said:

The two meters and the two standing charges suggest that it may once have been THTC or some other weird legacy tariff and that it may not now be genuine E7.  It might also help to explain the very high kWh rates.

Agreed, something is not right for sure and a messed up THTC conversion is likely...

@bunny73 - is the immersion heater for the hot water tank on a timer or does it switch on and off over night on its own?

bunny73

Gerry1 said:

Can you clarify the facts please, they don't seem correct.

● Please provide actual meter readings, preferably with a photo of the meter.  You can't possibly use 508kWh every day for three weeks, the average yearly consumption is 2400 (low), 4200 (medium) and 7100kWh (high) for an electricity only property.

●  You should be paying only one standing charge.  Victory: 2 MPANs but one SC

Your least worst option would probably be to switch to High Heat Retention night storage heaters on the cheapest E7 tariff you can find.  They're not cheap but an electric boiler on single rate is cripplingly expensive, and an E7 tariff (and an expensive one at that) makes it the most expensive heating you could possibly have.  Make sure the HHRs are big enough, otherwise you will end up topping them up at daytime rates which defeats the object.  If in doubt go for a larger size.  Also make sure you fully understand the programming and your E7 times, especially if you cut corners by using a single supply for them rather than a 24h supply for the fan and (very rare) top-up charging plus an E7 supply switched by the meter for overnight charging.

It’s 508 for three weeks, since 05/01. Using two radiators. They are not storage heaters, as far as I can tell, as it is a wet electric system.

Gerry1

Your kWh consumption isn't particularly surprising.  Pro rata it's 8805kWh per year, but obviously you won't be using the same amount in July as you were in January.

You need to get on the best single rate tariff you can find, pay only one standing charge and then switch to a system that is cheaper to run.

Gerry1

You seems to have inherited a weird and wonderful meter and tariff.  I'd guess it once had storage heaters and someone was very badly advised to change it to an electric boiler but failed to change the tariff accordingly.

Group Code 115 suggests it's an 8.5 hour split tariff but your DNO (dial 105) would be be able to confirm.  However, it's largely water under the bridge because if you have a genuine electric boiler supplying wet radiators you would need a single rate.

Your Horstmann immersion heater timer also suggests you have a split cheap rate, although it appears to be set for eight hours.

Assuming you can't get gas and that you don't want or can't have oil, LPG or a heat pump, then your best bet is probably High Heat Retention Night Storage Heaters on Economy 7.  In the meantime, switch to single rate with a single standing charge (you shouldn't need a meter change, but you'll probably be pressurised into accepting a smart meter) and adjust the Horstmann timer appropriately, perhaps to shorter times.

Your meter seems to be just over 11 years old, suggesting an average annual consumption of around 7885kWh on Rate 1 and 2815kWh on Rate 2, so rather on the high side.  This may explain why the system was changed, but sadly from the frying pan into the fire !

bunny73

Thanks Gerry.

I am in a top 2nd floor flat and there's only elec in the building. 

I’ll see what good energy say about the meter and the second standing charge. 

I’m wary of putting in a new system if bills are still high, but it would be worth it if I was warmer. 

bunny73

The flat is 56 sqm and am using heating in 4 sqm, the smallest bedroom. Would I be better getting an oil filled radiator and switching the heating off? 

QrizB

bunny73 said:

I’ll see what good energy say about the meter and the second standing charge.

That explains the high rates; Good energy are one of the three "deep green" suppliers that are exempt from the Ofgem cap.

I suspect you're on one of their regular E7 tariffs.

Your photos show a single meter; are you certain that you're paying two standing charges? If you are, there should be two meter serial numbers listed on your bill. Where is the other one?

bunny73

QrizB said:

bunny73 said:

I’ll see what good energy say about the meter and the second standing charge.

That explains the high rates; Good energy are one of the three "deep green" suppliers that are exempt from the Ofgem cap.

I suspect you're on one of their regular E7 tariffs.

Your photos show a single meter; are you certain that you're paying two standing charges? If you are, there should be two meter serial numbers listed on your bill. Where is the other one?

I am charged for two standing charges on my bill. One for the day and night readings and another for a reading that doesn’t change, it stays at 00001. These are all from the one meter, I access it by pressing a button on the front of the meter. There is only one meter number on the bill though, but they quote it twice?