Council renting - deliberate overcrowding?

deannagone

I just can't see the council even daring to threaten to evict a parent for moving a minor child into social housing, whatever the repercussions in terms of space. That reference is more for people who are moving people in who don't 'have' to live at the property.  You are legally obligated to house your daughter as her parent.  I really wouldn't worry about that.   I sympathise with the problem as described.  Obviously understand that your daughter may need some intervention to help her cope. I use a low cost private counsellor (they do exist) I found through the BACP 
https://www.bacp.co.uk/search/Therapists . MIND also run a low cost children's counselling service.But there may be a waiting list.  Be aware that it might take time to find a counsellor that's a 'good fit' for your family.  Given the history, there is probably a need for some kind of counselling service but obviously that's your choice.  I come from a background of 'difficult' family history myself and didn't realise how it was impacting my children initially.  

Is there a room big enough to divide up (perhaps with IKEA cupboards or something similar) to allow your older and younger daughter to share but have some privacy?

I hope this helps.

I know when some adaptations were made to the kitchen here, the day before the contractors started I was told the grant the council were using (it is social housing) could only be used once.  If I moved, it wouldn't be done again.  So this is a complication if the same rules apply to your situation.  However I was told there were properties already adapted that I could move to if I needed to downsize. It did give me pause for thought and wish i had been told this sooner as part of the decision process, however your situation is different to mine.  But if the same rules apply, it probably would complicate a move to a larger property.

SallyDucati

I don't see why a 14yo and 16yo can't share, even if it's a council 'rule'.   I shared a 6ft by 8ft room with my sister until she was 18 and I was 14. It worked.

I would be surprised if the council evicted you for this, they even put people in overcrowded situations as they have no other suitable accommodation available.

Chandler85

I suspect it is a guideline as oppose to a rule, but the council offered you an appropriate 3 bedroom house which suited your needs, if you then choose to change their needs as soon as you move it.  To suddenly claim that you need a bigger properly due to a 16 year old being "entitled" to their own room.  There will be people in worse overcrowding situation then that.

The council are unlikely to try to evict you or end your tenancy over it if the 16 and 14 year old share a room.  If you start sleeping on the sofa and your 3 daughters have their own rooms, I still don't think you are likely to be kicked out of the property but I doubt it will be looked at favourably.

While you are also housed, the chances of changing to a bigger property is also much less likely even if you are overcrowded as their will always be the next family who will be in the situation you may have found yourself in recently, with nowhere to live and two children to care for etc.

madman1981

Thanks to everyone for your replies.

In all honesty I don't want nor have a asked for a bigger house even if that's what the law/guidance states I'm entitled to. I've spent money decorating and making this house a home for two girls just the way they wanted that's not something I want to do again plus it would unsettle my Autistic daughter and would struggle with the changes. So hopefully the council will be understanding when they do a review 

thegreenone

We are almost at the end of the year now and May will come around quickly.

You daughter is joining you and her sisters at a very unsettled time for her and all the girls are heading for exams, teenage girl years, relationships etc etc etc. and need their individual space.  My thought would be to buy yourself a proper bed and find a corner in the reception room.  Push the sofa up to it to give more space during the day and push that out for the night.  Hopefully, everyone will get a good night's sleep and you will get through this.

I'm sorry if my answer is basic but I don't know anything about social housing.  It does sound as though you know how to be an amazing Dad who wants the best for his girls.

lincroft1710

If you think about it, a 16 yr old being "entitled" to their own room, would create immense problems for councils having to rehouse families whose homes no longer had sufficient bedrooms.


Certainly in private housing I was aware of several cases where a 16 yr old didn't have their own room, including one next door to me.

madman1981

deannagone said:

I just can't see the council even daring to threaten to evict a parent for moving a minor child into social housing, whatever the repercussions in terms of space. That reference is more for people who are moving people in who don't 'have' to live at the property.  You are legally obligated to house your daughter as her parent.  I really wouldn't worry about that.   I sympathise with the problem as described.  Obviously understand that your daughter may need some intervention to help her cope. I use a low cost private counsellor (they do exist) I found through the BACP 
MIND also run a low cost children's counselling service.But there may be a waiting list.  Be aware that it might take time to find a counsellor that's a 'good fit' for your family.  Given the history, there is probably a need for some kind of counselling service but obviously that's your choice.  I come from a background of 'difficult' family history myself and didn't realise how it was impacting my children initially.  

Is there a room big enough to divide up (perhaps with IKEA cupboards or something similar) to allow your older and younger daughter to share but have some privacy?

I hope this helps.

I know when some adaptations were made to the kitchen here, the day before the contractors started I was told the grant the council were using (it is social housing) could only be used once.  If I moved, it wouldn't be done again.  So this is a complication if the same rules apply to your situation.  However I was told there were properties already adapted that I could move to if I needed to downsize. It did give me pause for thought and wish i had been told this sooner as part of the decision process, however your situation is different to mine.  But if the same rules apply, it probably would complicate a move to a larger property.

Thank you, 

I already have one daughter open to CAMHS & other two on waiting list for CAMHS all for other issues unrelated to any impact from issues with there mom or the break up. But I'm sure they would probably benefit from therapy sooner rather than later. I will take a look at the link you posted as waiting for CAMHS will take for ever. 

I've considered splitting the main bedroom but it's still not big enough. 

That's interesting about the adaptions I didn't know that, the wet room was already in the property when we moved in but the ramp was put in afterwards with a use of a grant. An all honesty I don't want to move to bigger house happy to make it work here after spending money making it the way the girls wanted and give it another 3/4 years my oldest will want her own place with her boyfriend an most likely move out & it will take that long to get a 4 bedroom house anyway round here. 

Thanks again. 

theartfullodger

Are you sure it's overcrowded, legally?  (You'll need to measure each room, carefully) See...
https://england.shelter.org.uk/housing_advice/repairs/check_if_your_home_is_overcrowded_by_law


- places to use as bedrooms, legally, include sitting rooms and some large kitchens. (Is what the law says, not how I'd want to live).

If you are write a calm polite letter to council housing dept about the matter, with ages, genders, room sizes etc etc.. Keep copy:  Also speak with local councillor.

Best wishes

deannagone

My sons are autistic too.  As am I.  I think some people on here have kind of got the wrong idea about social housing.  Yes it is in very short supply, but it is there to meet a need and the people working in Housing departments are mostly humans (joke, you do seem to get some exceptions lol) and will understand that needs can change. I can't see you incurring any trouble at all for having your daughter come to live with you.  You are quite right to consider your older daughter may move out, leaving you in an under occupancy situation (bedroom tax could come in then) - but even then the council couldn't make you move out.  However the ages of your children does mean its probably not a good idea to move to a larger property.

My adaption was major and expensive.  I doubt having a ramp put in will meet the same criteria but understand you don't want to move.  

I had a lot of problems with schools etc accepting I could have not one but two children with autism, but I think its a lot more common than officialdom is prepared to accept. 

I have a large 3 seater good quality used leather reclining sofa bought for £300 on ebay (was able to organise collection at the time).  It is actually comfy enough to lie the full length and sleep on but has the bonus we can snuggle on the sofa, recline it and watch movies.  Plus doesn't take up extra space.   - but don't consider a plastic or bonded leather one, they can peel quite quickly.  There's also such a thing as pull down beds (bed in a cupboard).  Frames are available online or on ebay.

Norman_Castle

Norman_Castle said:

 Does your tenancy agreement state the total allowed occupancy?

As above.