Assistance with Appeal against Alliance Parking PCN

ImNoExpert

Just a heads up to those with NTK's, you'll likely get letters from a company called "Debt Recovery Plus" at some point, but please don't allow this to scare you, as it's just another standard tactic parking companies use.

The letter will likely have a tick list on the back which is aimed to intimidate you, as well as saying "we will recommend our client takes court action" but as has been mentioned above, additional charges that this letter includes can be legitimately argued against in court as an unenforceable extra.

One of the benefits of the ParkingEye / Barry Beavis case was to actually highlight that the initial charge (as shown on the signage) was enough to cover everything the parking company is claiming, such as admin and collection costs, which in that case was £85 I think? So in this case, Alliance Parking's initial charge of £100 is about as high as it can go, and the £160 is an amount you can challenge.

Don't reply to any letter from Debt Recovery Plus, but do keep it for future reference.

For what it's worth, I had an NTK from this company (A S Parking) over five years ago, and to date, it went as far as the Debt Recovery Plus letter, then nothing since. I don't believe this company has the gumption to take their tickets to court - their method of replies lacks any real professionalism - but do keep an eye on all letters you receive, and never EVER ignore an actual claim from the County Court business centre.

Varnesh

Just an update...

I contacted the IPC to complain that the keeper was sent an invoice, but Alliance would not accept an appeal from the keeper - only the driver. I said:

The appeals form on their website has a checkbox asking for confirmation that the person appealing was the driver of the vehicle. No other option is given in order to proceed. I understood the keeper could appeal (the basis of the appeal, inadequate signage, doesn't have a baring on whether it's the keeper or driver responding, as far as I can see).

I have appealed, and once into their form, you can state that the keeper is appealing. I got a reply saying they won't accept an appeal from the keeper of the vehicle. The PCN asking for payment was issued to the keeper so I don't understand why the keeper can't appeal.

I don't know how to exhaust their appeals procedure in order to be able to take the appeal to you.

They replied:

We have now had the opportunity to discuss with the operator and can confirm the below.

The Keeper is not currently being held liable for the parking charge unless they confirm they are the Driver.

If the Keeper was the driver they can appeal on the provision that they act in a fair and transparent manner and identify themselves as such.

If the Parking Operator doesn't receive payment or an appeal from the Driver then they can hold the Keeper liable for the Parking Charge and commence proceedings against them.

The only exceptions to this would be where the vehicle has been reported to the Police as stolen or cloned; or the vehicle registration number has been recorded incorrectly by the Parking Operator.

I am satisfied that the operator has followed the correct process. Any further queries should be directed to the Parking Operator.

So - the driver can appeal. The keeper can't. But the keeper is liable if no appeal is received from the driver. In that instance, the keeper still can't appeal.

Coupon-mad

Get your MP to please send the evidence and that IPC reply to the DLUHC and ask Mr Gove what his department is including in the new parking Code of Practice framework, to ensure that it confirms the right of a registered keeper to appeal a Notice of Parking Charge.  A right that flowed from the POFA in 2012, which specifically held back until 2013 the right to hold a keeper liable, until the trade body at the time (BPA) set up a system (POPLA) giving registered keepers (and drivers & hirers) the right to appeal without giving the name of the driver which was refused in the POFA Impact Assessment.

Here we have from the horse's mouth that the IPC says a parking firm can REFUSE to hear a registered keeper's appeal and instead, can say 'we are not actually holding you liable just yet!' And then can sit on their hands for a month, add a flat rate false 'damages' enhancement of £70 for no justified reason at all as a 'late penalty' and just sue them anyway.  Circumventing any appeal step completely.

This cannot be upheld by Government as acceptable.

Rhod

Hi
So to update I got the “Letter of Claim” letter today. Talk about bamboozling!!!
I have no idea what is written in it. My head is spinning.

Any advice as to how to respond ?

You can only email their complaints department so am tempted to do this stating the advice previously in this thread as in see you in court, don’t send this on to a collections agency as “in dispute” etc 

advice welcome please,

rhod 

KeithP

Rhod said:

Hi
So to update I got the “Letter of Claim” letter today. Talk about bamboozling!!!
I have no idea what is written in it. My head is spinning.

Any advice as to how to respond ?

Now you are getting close to a court case, I would strongly recommend that you start your own thread Trying to progress the issues of more than one person in a single thread will only lead to confusion.

The first few paragraphs of the second post in the NEWBIES thread  explain how to respond to a Letter of Claim.

Rhod

Varnesh said:

Just an update...

I contacted the IPC to complain that the keeper was sent an invoice, but Alliance would not accept an appeal from the keeper - only the driver. I said:

The appeals form on their website has a checkbox asking for confirmation that the person appealing was the driver of the vehicle. No other option is given in order to proceed. I understood the keeper could appeal (the basis of the appeal, inadequate signage, doesn't have a baring on whether it's the keeper or driver responding, as far as I can see).

I have appealed, and once into their form, you can state that the keeper is appealing. I got a reply saying they won't accept an appeal from the keeper of the vehicle. The PCN asking for payment was issued to the keeper so I don't understand why the keeper can't appeal.

I don't know how to exhaust their appeals procedure in order to be able to take the appeal to you.

They replied:

We have now had the opportunity to discuss with the operator and can confirm the below.

The Keeper is not currently being held liable for the parking charge unless they confirm they are the Driver.

If the Keeper was the driver they can appeal on the provision that they act in a fair and transparent manner and identify themselves as such.

If the Parking Operator doesn't receive payment or an appeal from the Driver then they can hold the Keeper liable for the Parking Charge and commence proceedings against them.

The only exceptions to this would be where the vehicle has been reported to the Police as stolen or cloned; or the vehicle registration number has been recorded incorrectly by the Parking Operator.

I am satisfied that the operator has followed the correct process. Any further queries should be directed to the Parking Operator.

So - the driver can appeal. The keeper can't. But the keeper is liable if no appeal is received from the driver. In that instance, the keeper still can't appeal.

Hi
I just read the above and have as yet avoided writing to IPC over exact same issues.

it would be interesting to write now though using some of coupon mad’s reply (legal stuff) and pre empt their stock answer of “ nothing to see here”

Rhod

Coupon-mad

Yes, complain to the IPC even though the guy that runs this PPC is on the IPC Steering Committee. 

Complain ANYWAY.

Also, they said this was a point when you can appeal against liability, so do that as well and see what utter dross they come back with.  The worse the responses, the better and the more reasonable you look, compared to them.

JUST DO NOT TRY THE £15 IAS 'NON-STANDARD LACK OF ADR, WHERE PEOPLE PAY TO INEVITABLY (96% OF THE TIME) LOSE.

Rhod

Hi Coupon,

Thanks for thd input (and Keith P above)

When you say “They said this was the point when you can appeal against Liability”

Are you saying I should fill in the responce pack they mention? 

Do you get a reply from this then!?

I will get in touch with IPC and start a new thread ad keith suggested. 

Cheers

Coupon-mad

Are you saying I should fill in the responce pack they mention? 

No, the NEWBIES thread covers LBC stage and is very clear about not filling in response forms.

D_P_Dance

Please read the newbies.  Unless you do you will struggle.