Can someone help me?: Elnur HHR storage

jadey2024

Hello,

I'm hoping someone can help me understand these heaters. Apologies in advance  I have mild autism and I can also get confused easily amongst other things.

I'm renting a private property 13 yrs now. On E7 and the landlady (through estate agents) had new storage heaters put in April just gone on the government grant thing. Previously had 3 old storage heaters (looked 80s) and one new storage heater a few years old (not a smart one) These were all ripped out and replaced with two panel heaters in the two bedrooms and two elnur ECOHHR20 smart storage heaters in living room and landing. The guys who installed them didn't explain much and I didn't ask much because I wanted them gone quick as awkward with people I don't know and  them being in my home but I also took for granted they would work like the old storage heaters to a degree in that turn on and it build heat up at night, give heat out in day, so made a wrong assumption with these heaters I soon learnt with one area where they not like my old ones. Since it was April when they were installed I didn't have them turned on (other than turned on at the mains plug as the guys said they need to always be on at mains to not lose settings saved so I've left them turned on there constantly but turned off on the switch on side of actual storage heater, until tonight) Well the flat has gone cold so decided to put one storage heater on ready for economy 7 later (With old storage heaters I turned on at mains before bed as no switch on actual storage heaters unlike these and they only came on when e7 time kicked in) but I was surprised to find that as soon as I turned on the switch on storage heater I was getting immediate heat. I thought they were only to get heat built up during night first like my old ones and not get heat immediately when turning on? Seems they are convectors as well as storage heaters? which worries me as I don't want to be using daytime units. I've now turned it off till I understand it more but I gone and got a headache and stressing as it's all new and not so simple. Is there a way to turn off the convector so the storage only comes on during the e7 times like the old ones did? Otherwise I fear these are not going to be cost effective if using day time and night time units and it was drilled into me I'd save money on this grant plus they are quite noisy and it's annoying. I would imagine fact it was turned on for first time at 9pm and getting immediate heat it was using day units for that one hour anyway which I don't want. I didn't have bad high bills with my old storage heaters and found they did a grand job keeping us warm and I'm actually sad and pining for them now.

So in a nutshell how do I turn off convector (the instructions have no say on this it seems)and advice on settings to get best cost effective usage as  I fear I may be worst of financially on bills though hoping I'm wrong as I'm not flush. 

QrizB

Hi jadey2024.

Modern storage heaters like your Elnur ones all have a back-up convector element as well as their main "storage" function. They use this to stop you getting cold if you run out of stored heat during the day.

I suspect that when you turned your storage heaters on, they were cold and the logic in the heater decided to turn on the convector to warm your room.

If you switch them on tonight, they might use the convector again but once it gets to E7 hours they will charge up and work as normal.

Thnere are a set of instructions here (link) that might help (you may already have these). Starting from page 8 it tells you how to set the thermostat with your day and night temperatures.

Can you try that tonight and let us know how you get on?

jadey2024

Thank you for your reply. 
I will put one on tonight and try it. I will put them on about 11pm as want to avoid using day units as much as possible. I'm not sure what my e7 times are but for my area a few websites say the e7 times here is from 11.30pm but not sure if that is accurate but will put on about 11pm.  My e7 electric unit box in the house don't have the times on it. 
I will look at the link thank you. From what I gather from the manual it is automatically set to all day at home function, we are out during week from 9am-3pm so that's no good on that function I'm guessing. 

We woke up to such a cold flat. The panel heaters are supposed to be cost effective but my daughter is in her room when not at school and I can't afford to run them when she's home from school and at weekends on day units since they are double price so she has been cold last couple days in her room despite jumpers, blankets and dressing gown on.  With storage heaters in our rooms it was warm in our rooms during day and cosy walking up. I put her panel heater on a timer last night for the first time about 11pm and set it to be on for a few hours (can't seem to find a way to set these earlier to come on at night only) and it was warm for those few hours but she woke up to a cold bedroom and condensation on windows because the heat went quickly once it came off even though her door is shut. (The flat is insulated on grant too with wall/loft cavity and landlady put new windows in but still a cold flat) We do have some windows open on latch during day to avoid mould issues but wouldn't want them open at night too) So I'm worried about mould now in bedrooms on these new panel heaters as we've always been good to avoid that in last several years (Had it a bit when first moved in but that was my fault and soon learnt to keep it at bay)

QrizB

jadey2024 said:

We woke up to such a cold flat. The panel heaters are supposed to be cost effective but my daughter is in her room when not at school and I can't afford to run them when she's home from school and at weekends on day units since they are double price so she has been cold last couple days in her room despite jumpers, blankets and dressing gown on.

Panel heaters get fitted in bedrooms on the assumption they are only used for sleeping. In this case you need a quick blast of heat in the evening as you get ready for bed, and another in the morning when you wake up. If the bedroom is being used during the day then panel heaters are not a good choice. It's a shame your landlady didn't realise this (panel heaters also have the advantage of being much cheaper to buy than storage heaters).

jadey2024 said:

So I'm worried about mould now in bedrooms on these new panel heaters as we've always been good to avoid that in last several years (Had it a bit when first moved in but that was my fault and soon learnt to keep it at bay)

You probably know this already but in most cases mould is due to condensation, which in turn is due to too little heat and/or too little ventilation. A dehumidifier might help, even if you only run it at night on E7 rates (and will have the side effect of adding a litltle bit of warmth). Can you borrow one from anyone to try for a while?

danrv

jadey2024 said:

I put her panel heater on a timer last night for the first time about 11pm and set it to be on for a few hours (can't seem to find a way to set these earlier to come on at night only) and it was warm for those few hours but she woke up to a cold bedroom and condensation on windows because the heat went quickly once it came off even though her door is shut.

Do you have the make and model of the panel heater?
You should be able to set a user timer for say 7am - 9am then another two hours in the evening.
Then switch it to manual mode for any other times/use.

I have a few £20 convectors that are easy to use as they have a dial type 24hr timer with a switch to engage a 24hr pattern or manual use. 
I set the thermostat fairly low. 

jadey2024

Hello, 

The panel heaters are electrorad model# HPH01-05E/10E/15E/20E.
I can't make head or tail of the instructions. From what I can get, it has  some preset programs on P1/P2 but they run all day/night I think?
Then P3 is one you can adjust yourself but it seems I have to choose between ECO or COMFORT for my chosen hours rather than no heat at all when out during day or early evening and just to come on late eve/early morning.  Ideally I want it to run just before bed for 2 hours and again 2 hours before we wake up. We do go bed late and last night I set my daughters on a timer at about 11pm to 1pm (I was OK without heat then so just put hers on)  I needed a loo trip at 5am and ran them both from that time until 7am on the timer but I disturb my daughter going in her room to set the timers as it beeps loudly when you turn the heater on  These times did work overall well for us as the rooms still feel warm for a good hour after the heaters go off and so warm for when we wake up. Plus, it's mainly using my E7 rates during those times. I really want to avoid day rates as much as possible.

It would be much better if I don't have to keep messing about to set timers at these certain times. I may also need to boost it an hour for my daughters room about 8pm as she is in her room mostly after school but I don't want that on a timer. I have had them running at temp 18 which is just right for our rooms at moment. 

jadey2024

 That's the preset programs.  I can't adjust them. 

jadey2024

And that's the program I can adjust  if I want to

danrv

Looks like there’s four modes that you can select via the MODE button.
I’d setup a 7 day pattern as per the 2nd pic and select comfort for the required time slots.
Ideally you want to be able to select off for the times in between but looks like it’s either COMFORT or ECO.
That would mean the radiator is always operating in P3 mode or maybe as it’s set 4 degrees lower, it may not kick in anyway.

For manual or random use, push M until in COMFORT mode. Then the radiator thermostat will maintain the selected temperature until turned off or P3 selected again. Just don’t turn off at the wall otherwise the settings might be lost.

jadey2024

It does seem it will run constantly. Which isn't practical at all. The 4 degrees lower is eco mode which is 18c. We are usually out most the day. So obviously waste putting them on them but all those programs by looks would need to run constantly on either eco or comfort. It's a huge silly flaw on these heaters if that's the case. I will email manufacturer just to see if that's definitely how they run or I can have them off during day. 

I was just wondering if you or someone could explain the electric meters things to me to make sure I'm understanding the right.
I took a reading yesterday morning and one this morning to get an idea of my 24 hour usage with the one storage and two panel heaters in use.
(although it's more 22hrs between each readings)

I didn't have the panels run much last night though. Both panels ran a total of 4 hours (One of which is a day unit hour)

Yesterday morning my night reading was 60899 and this morning it was 60906 with a difference of 7. Does that mean it used 7 kwh? 
The storage heater is 7 hours but it don't bring in the panel heaters then which used 3 hours during night. My panel heaters are 10000watts.

QrizB

jadey2024 said:

Yesterday morning my night reading was 60899 and this morning it was 60906 with a difference of 7. Does that mean it used 7 kwh? 
The storage heater is 7 hours but it don't bring in the panel heaters then which used 3 hours during night. My panel heaters are 10000watts.

Yes, you used 7kWh of electricity overnight. Was that with the storage heater as well, or just the panel heaters?

Are the heaters like these?
https://www.mdeelectricalsupplies.co.uk/product/electrorad-panel-heaters-1000w/

If so, the full instructions are here (I know jadey2024 has a set but others night be interested):

https://www.electrorad.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/Contract-Panel-Instructions-Nov-2019.pdf

jadey2024 said:

It does seem it will run constantly. Which isn't practical at all. The 4 degrees lower is eco mode which is 18c. We are usually out most the day. So obviously waste putting them on them but all those programs by looks would need to run constantly on either eco or comfort. It's a huge silly flaw on these heaters if that's the case. I will email manufacturer just to see if that's definitely how they run or I can have them off during day.

I think the idea is that your house shouldn't cool by more than 4 deg C while they're in "eco" mode, so having them on then shouldn't use any electricity unless it's extremely cold. I know that my house, for example, only cools by 2-3 degrees overnight (even with the heating off) unless it's a severe winter.