Internet fraud on my bank account

born_again

Thrugelmir said:

ianconnelly said:

 I have concrete evidence that my phone has been hacked and have supplied the bank with this and they have completely turned their back on me. 

How did the hacker access your bank account though.  How did they obtain the information, fingerprint, facial recognition to access? 

Odds on debit card payments so they simply had OP card number.
Given card was stopped.

So they did not physically access OP bank account & remove funds.

Clearly Nationwide have enough evidence to tie this to the OP. 

AskAsk

Thrugelmir said:

ianconnelly said:

 I have concrete evidence that my phone has been hacked and have supplied the bank with this and they have completely turned their back on me. 

How did the hacker access your bank account though.  How did they obtain the information, fingerprint, facial recognition to access? 

we don't have enough information from the OP to really answer this question properly as you say we don't even know if the transactions were done over the phone and how they accessed his bank account on his phone to make the payments to the gambling sites.

the OP would have to have his bank app on his phone and his email app on his phone as well and the thieves being able to access his phone and that would only allow a BACS payment rather than a debit card payment.

AskAsk

born_again said:

Thrugelmir said:

ianconnelly said:

 I have concrete evidence that my phone has been hacked and have supplied the bank with this and they have completely turned their back on me. 

How did the hacker access your bank account though.  How did they obtain the information, fingerprint, facial recognition to access? 

Odds on debit card payments so they simply had OP card number.
Given card was stopped.

So they did not physically access OP bank account & remove funds.

Clearly Nationwide have enough evidence to tie this to the OP. 

to make a payment using a debit card, and this is the normal way to top up your account on a gambling site, the thieves would need the long card number, the name on the card, the expiry date and the CSV code so they would have had to steal his card from him and he hasn't said his card was stolen.

so unless he had stored this information on a note pad on his phone for the thieves to steal, if they had access to his phone.  and then they would definately need access to his phone as the bank would need to authorise the payment by sending him a PIN number to verify the payment, but not all payments will be going through this security.

as large amounts were paid out one after the other in the middle of the night, i doubt this would have been authorised by the bank without sending out a PIN number to authorise the transactions.

does sound like a very complicated case of hacking if the OP's phone had been hacked and then the bank would argue that he shouldn't have stored his debit card details on the phone so they would not accept liability for the fraud.

a certainly difficult case to fight this one.

Ergates

One obvious question:   The £10,000 that was transferred to the gambling sites - what happened to it?   Where did it go?   Is it still there?

Yorkshire_Pud

Ergates said:

One obvious question:   The £10,000 that was transferred to the gambling sites - what happened to it?   Where did it go?   Is it still there?

Yes why would the ‘scammers’ transfer the money to a third party gambling site over which they have no control unless they used the money to gamble with posing as OP and lost or won and transferred the winnings to where exactly!? Presumably any winnings are sent to the bank account that was used to fund the gambling pot, otherwise it wouldn’t be secure, would it?

kaMelo

Yorkshire_Pud said:

Ergates said:

One obvious question:   The £10,000 that was transferred to the gambling sites - what happened to it?   Where did it go?   Is it still there?

Yes why would the ‘scammers’ transfer the money to a third party gambling site over which they have no control unless they used the money to gamble with posing as OP and lost or won and transferred the winnings to where exactly!? Presumably any winnings are sent to the bank account that was used to fund the gambling pot, otherwise it wouldn’t be secure, would it?

Precisely why there is always scepticism related to fraud and gambling sites, payment transfers into gambling sites are authenticated via the bank and the only way out is back to the bank where the authenticated payment came from.  
It may not be impossible but looks a very complicated way to commit fraud. I suppose playing and deliberately losing to someone is one way but are there any games on gambling sites that are one on one where you can choose your opponent?

Ergates

kaMelo said:
It may not be impossible but looks a very complicated way to commit fraud. I suppose playing and deliberately losing to someone is one way but are there any games on gambling sites that are one on one where you can choose your opponent?

Someone suggested that above - I don't know anything abhout online gambling - is that a thing you can do?   Wouldn#t it also be pretty easy to trace?

Shakin_Steve

I'm pretty sure if I tried to transfer £10,000 into a gambling site over 24 hours, my bank(s) would be trying to contact me.

Yorkshire_Pud

Gambling online is a terrible thing for many people and forces them into desperate behaviours with the fallout from their actions, because the whole idea is to make people lose their money whilst throwing them the odd bone to keep up the momentum/addiction to completely wring out the mugs that do it and their families that suffer too.

Ought to be a law against it.

Who wins? The betting firms spewing their venal enticements and government through tax.

Who loses? The mug gamblers and society that has to pick up the pieces.

AskAsk

Ergates said:

kaMelo said:
It may not be impossible but looks a very complicated way to commit fraud. I suppose playing and deliberately losing to someone is one way but are there any games on gambling sites that are one on one where you can choose your opponent?

Someone suggested that above - I don't know anything abhout online gambling - is that a thing you can do?   Wouldn#t it also be pretty easy to trace?

i mentioned earlier that the OP would find it difficult to convince anyone that he didn't do it as it doesn't make sense for someone to steal your money by paying the gambling sites as they are more likely to lose the money to the sites than win anything and even if they did win, the money would go back to the OP's account anyway so seems pretty dumb.

however, someone suggested the thieves could play with their accomplice on the gambling site in poker and lose intentionally then their accomplice (accomplices) would then draw the money out.

i don't know if you can choose your accomplice to play poker with on a gambling site but i guess you would be able to choose players to play with.  this would then be a more rational explanation of why the thieves would want to move the money this way rather than just pay the money directly into their own bank account or accounts.

the advantage of this method of stealing is that it would be difficult for the OP to convince anyone he didn't do it as people would not believe him and think he gambled the money and then regretted his actions as already mentioned in the thread.  this would avoid an investigation by the bank or the police.

tracing where the money went on a gambling site will also be more complicated and will take longer than tracing a direct payment from the OP's account to other bank accounts.