Forget Smart Meters, here are my practical top tips for saving energy and using less water,

Keu

I don't know why you feel the need to keep getting at me, at the very best it might be £100 less and as it is over £1000 as I have shown above it will not be a lot less, it is huge.

I'm not getting at you. I am trying to help you as I am genuinely concerned for your well-being.

As per my own example above, I struggle to see how an accurate calculation of the cost increase for you could be more than £200-£300 tops and so nowhere close to £1000. If it truly were anywhere near the £1000 figure then it would reflect a lifestyle nothing like you have described, and if this were the case then there is huge scope for a much more moderate approch to energy/money saving.

The move to Shell at capped Tariff is only part of it.

Gov said last week they are adding £190 levy to gas bills according to radio news. There may be a reduction in Electricity but I will not benefit from it.

"The Government will release a series of consultations before going ahead with the plan, which is likely to start in 2023 and could add £170 a year to gas bills, the paper reported."


OFGEM predicts 30% increase in Tarriff Cap in April because it is based on what wholesalers are paying and spot rates, we are already well into the assessment period and things are not getting better, I think it could be higher than 30% but that is the amount I used.

"Analysts have predicted UK customers could see their energy bills rise by 30% next year.

Research agency Cornwall Insight has claimed further volatile gas prices and the potential collapse of even more suppliers could push the energy price cap to around £1,660 in summer.

The forecast is approximately 30% higher than the record £1,277 price cap set for winter 2021-22, which commenced at the start of October."

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/government-energy-bills-prime-minister-the-times-cop26-b959627.html

This MSE site says that customers of Green go from £810 to £1,277 at Shell at average will face increase of £467

moneysavingexpert.com/news/2021/09/energy-firm-gone-bust--how-your-new-firm-and-tariff-stacks-up

add 30% at £383 is £850 increase taking annual to £1660 

Add the £190 takes it to £1850, so over £1000 more (1850-810=1040)

OFGEM said it would be £138 increase in Tariff cap well straight off I got hit with more than 3x that, not because I am a high energy user but because I did what we were told to do,I got a good deal.

Ultrasonic said:

@Keu out of interest I have checked the annual cost increase for me moving from Pure Planet to Shell and it will be about £143 per year (£538 to £681). I only switched to PP in May so the difference will be smaller than if you had an older deal I just wanted to give you an idea of some real world numbers for a lower energy user (which I am but nothing like as extreme as you have described).

I did not say I was with pure planet, what is this obsession with my energy usage, do you think I am telling lies?

My personal usage is something that might identify me so I am reluctant to post personal data.

I am also reluctant to post more because you just seem to disagree for the sake of it.

I have my spreadsheet, I have my app which has 6 years of data, so I know my usage and the likely cost.

MWT

Sadly you are still taking a bunch of generalised figures that at best reference a 'typical' user and not your specific use, and at worst you are simple misunderstanding what has been reported.

Plenty of people here are happy to help you work out a better estimate of what the increases are likely to be for you and all you need to do is share your actual energy consumption figures.

If you are worried about being identified through those numbers (highly unlikely) just round them off a bit. No need to say which region you are in as we can use an average of the regions for the calculations.

Keu

elsien said:

Not sure where the fish tank obsession is coming from  -you do keep mentioning it but homes with them are a minority. 

I don’t think I know anyone with a huge American fridge, or big range cookers either.

Yes energy costs are going to impact more on low income families but I live in a low income area and I can’t see people going to the same extremes that you are. 

Just giving random examples, I saw someone on another forum asking why he had huge usage, they went through it with him and then near the end he mentioned a fish tank and it was the culprit.  

The fridge and range cooker came up with a neighbour doing a new kitchen, they do not even have kids yet and are getting them, some might think it adds value to the house but I would rip them out.    

I was probably a bit obsessive about cutting costs, not all of them are for everybody, they may come up with their own and better ideas 

Sea_Shell

Keu said:

I don't know why you feel the need to keep getting at me, at the very best it might be £100 less and as it is over £1000 as I have shown above it will not be a lot less, it is huge.

I'm not getting at you. I am trying to help you as I am genuinely concerned for your well-being.

As per my own example above, I struggle to see how an accurate calculation of the cost increase for you could be more than £200-£300 tops and so nowhere close to £1000. If it truly were anywhere near the £1000 figure then it would reflect a lifestyle nothing like you have described, and if this were the case then there is huge scope for a much more moderate approch to energy/money saving.

My personal usage is something that might identify me so I am reluctant to post personal data.

People are only trying to help.  Is it so bad to have your figures double checked by another (few) pair of eyes.   It's easy to have made a calculation error.    Also it does seem that your hard cut back approach may lead to anxiety and discomfort.

As for how your usage may identify you, I have no idea why you'd think that! 

Our usage is fairly consistent over the years at 1700kw of Electric and 13000kw of Gas*  (I too keep a spreadsheet!) - Can you identify me from that information?

Our current fix with E.on is due to cost £780pa (on those figures) and if we were on the current price cap, we'd be in the region of £1050pa

We are a couple in a 4 bed detached house, and we aren't taking any of the drastic measures that you are to reduce energy.  We're mindful of our usage, of course, but we're just carrying on with life.   

This is why people are questioning that you believe YOUR bill will rise by £1000 per year.

Even if we're put on a 30% inflated price cap come April, our bill would only be in the region of £1365.   Also, as I understand it, any "levies" applied would be proportionate to your usage (like the cap) and so wouldn't be a flat £170-£190 on everyone's bill.

But even with both these rises applied, our bill would likely hit £1565.   Ouch....but still not an increase of £1000 over what we are currently paying.    

So,  can you not see where we are coming from?



* We had a new boiler fitted a few months ago, so hopefully our Gas consumption will drop off from previous years.   Even just the fact it no longer has a pilot light will save us 4kw of Gas per day!!!!!

[Deleted User]

@Sea_Shell It will provided you set the boiler flow temperature to a level that will result in a return flow less than 56C, and your radiator system has been adjusted to deal with lower flow temperatures. Sadly, evidence in real life indicates that most condensing boilers rarely condense because the flow temperature has been set too high. How do I know that my boiler is actually condensing: the boiler flue should not be steaming.

The boiler efficiency comes from the boiler extracting heat out of the steaming vapour. FWiW, the boiler flow temperature on my WB boiler is currently set at 60C.

Brewer21

"The Government will release a series of consultations before going ahead with the plan, which is likely to start in 2023 and could add £170 a year to gas bills, the paper reported."

Stop listening to media reports, you know or should know most are a bunch of rumour mongering leaches. 
At least you've got two years to save up the extra on the latest reporting.🤨

[Deleted User]

A further thought to inform those who shun smart meters. We are likely to see an increasing number of time-of-use tariffs coming to the market. No longer will a simple kWhs/year price comparison result in the cheapest tariff. BEIS has already commissioned/developed a tool that, with the consumer’s permission, can pull a year’s worth of 30 minute usage data from a smart meter which is then used to ‘populate’ the tariff comparison tool. This will then give you the cheapest tariff based not just on how much energy is used but when it is used.

To access smart meter data, price comparison websites will have to become Registered DCC Users or partner with an organisation that is. Data is pulled from smart meters using a sophisticated piece of secure software known as an Adaptor. 

In sum, to save money, consumers need to know when to use electricity. For example, I get cheap energy for 5 hours each evening. The washer; dishwasher; tumble dryer go on when energy is at its cheapest.

[Deleted User]

Smart meters concern me for a few reasons and also see benefits but if they start chucking out cheap rates when people are in bed, there is no way in the world I am running high load devices when I am asleep.

GingerTim

half_empty said:

Smart meters concern me for a few reasons and also see benefits but if they start chucking out cheap rates when people are in bed, there is no way in the world I am running high load devices when I am asleep.

A guy who used to live in a a flat above mine years ago must have been on an economy 7 tariff and would put his washing machine on at 10pm - unfortunately it was directly above my bedroom. Drove me mad.

[Deleted User]

GingerTim said:

half_empty said:

Smart meters concern me for a few reasons and also see benefits but if they start chucking out cheap rates when people are in bed, there is no way in the world I am running high load devices when I am asleep.

A guy who used to live in a a flat above mine years ago must have been on an economy 7 tariff and would put his washing machine on at 10pm - unfortunately it was directly above my bedroom. Drove me mad.

Stayed in a Granny Grim B+B once with ensuite washer and dryer for the whole premises. That was fun, "it will be OK, you won't notice...." the joys of limited overnight expenses.

But we used to run the appliances on timers before I took notice of the fire/death risk and we did not use enough at those times for the economy 7 anyway to get the cheaper rates to kick in. Cheaper and safer for us to drop it. We now use way more efficient machines but rather they are all off when we are asleep.