Forget Smart Meters, here are my practical top tips for saving energy and using less water,

Ultrasonic

Keu said:

GingerTim said:

And if you really want to micro-manage your consumption, a smart meter would actually be really useful.

As I understand it, Smart Meter displays do not itemise where it is coming from, they go a lovely shade of red if you put the kettle on, once the thing knows your typical usage it will just accept your fridge usage as a baseline.  Writing usage from the device I suggest tells you what the device is using, you can compare that online, decide to replace etc.

One feature I think you may be missing is that an in-home display connected to smart meters can tell you how much money you have spent on energy in essentially real time. Pretending for a second that Pure Planet hadn't gone bust, my smart meter tells me I've spent a total of 89p so far today for example (including the standing charges). 

QrizB

Ultrasonic said:

One feature I think you may be missing is that an in-home display connected to smart meters can tell you how much money you have spent on energy in essentially real time. Pretending for a second that Pure Planet hadn't gone bust, my smart meter tells me I've spent a total of 89p so far today for example (including the standing charges). 

Deleted because I'm an idiot

Ultrasonic

QrizB said:

Ultrasonic said:

One feature I think you may be missing is that an in-home display connected to smart meters can tell you how much money you have spent on energy in essentially real time. Pretending for a second that Pure Planet hadn't gone bust, my smart meter tells me I've spent a total of 89p so far today for example (including the standing charges). 

Mine seems to include the standing charge; based on my tariff I've used less than 60p of electricity today, but the IHD says ~80p which would be about right if you add the SC. Are you sure yours doesn't?

Read my post again  .

GingerTim

Ultrasonic said:

said:

GingerTim said:

And if you really want to micro-manage your consumption, a smart meter would actually be really useful.

As I understand it, Smart Meter displays do not itemise where it is coming from, they go a lovely shade of red if you put the kettle on, once the thing knows your typical usage it will just accept your fridge usage as a baseline.  Writing usage from the device I suggest tells you what the device is using, you can compare that online, decide to replace etc.

One feature I think you may be missing is that an in-home display connected to smart meters can tell you how much money you have spent on energy in essentially real time. Pretending for a second that Pure Planet hadn't gone bust, my smart meter tells me I've spent a total of 89p so far today for example (including the standing charges). 

EDF seem to be able to break down my usage into fairly useful categories ('always on', 'cooking' etc) - how accurate that is I'm not sure, but it's helped me target certain things. But yes, I'd like to know pretty sharpish if anything is chewing through unusually high amounts of electricity owing to a fault (or, more likely, forgetting to switch something off).

Ultrasonic

GingerTim said:

Ultrasonic said:

said:

GingerTim said:

And if you really want to micro-manage your consumption, a smart meter would actually be really useful.

As I understand it, Smart Meter displays do not itemise where it is coming from, they go a lovely shade of red if you put the kettle on, once the thing knows your typical usage it will just accept your fridge usage as a baseline.  Writing usage from the device I suggest tells you what the device is using, you can compare that online, decide to replace etc.

One feature I think you may be missing is that an in-home display connected to smart meters can tell you how much money you have spent on energy in essentially real time. Pretending for a second that Pure Planet hadn't gone bust, my smart meter tells me I've spent a total of 89p so far today for example (including the standing charges). 

EDF seem to be able to break down my usage into fairly useful categories ('always on', 'cooking' etc) which has helped me target certain things. 

My smart meter was provided by EOn but clearly isn't as 'smart' as yours in that doesn't break-down usage like this. I'm not sure how it could approximate what use might be cooking though?

For the OP it was simply being able to budget better that I had in mind. In that rather that being apparently so afraid of a large bill that the heating will pretty much never be used, it would be possible to far better judge what might actually be affordable. Although it would be prudent to just manually confirm the accuracy of the calculated cost early on before trusting it.

Keu

Ultrasonic said:

Keu said:

Ultrasonic said:

Keu said:

Ultrasonic said:

Keu said:
Even at my low usage I am facing over £1k extra on energy so those with bigger bills will be facing much more.

Are you talking about bills based on the Shell tariff you'll be moving to? If so there is no way a low energy user will have an (annual) bill increasing by anythng like as much as £1,000. If you are genuinely stressing because of this then you really don't need to. 

The move to Shell at capped Tarriff is only part of it.

Gov said last week they are adding £190 to gas bills according to radio news. There may be a reduction in Electricity but I will not benefit from it.

OFGEM predicts 30% increase in Tarriff Cap in April because it is based on what wholesalers are paying and spot rates, we are already well into the assessment period and things are not getting better, I think it could be higher than 30% but that is the amount I used.

This site says that customers of Green go from £810 to £1,277 at Shell at average will face increase of £467

moneysavingexpert.com/news/2021/09/energy-firm-gone-bust--how-your-new-firm-and-tariff-stacks-up

add 30% at £383 is £850 increase taking annual to £1660

Add the £190 takes it to £1850, so over £1000 more.

So work out your own figures because the cap is not on the amount paid it is on the tariff.

OFGEM said it would be £138 increase in Tariff cap well straight off I got hit with more than 3x that, not because I am a high energy user but because I did what we were told to do, I got a good deal.

What really pisses me off is that even if I use zero energy I still have to pay those standing charges.

OFGEM should make every supplier have to provide a zero standing charge tariff with no pre-conditions and the rate no higher than the average of all their tariffs.  At least then we could batten down the hatches and reduce our costs.

The energy companies must be laughing they got us to pay £13bn for their smart meter programme when they are the on beneficiaries, even when they botched it up with meters that turned dumb it was obvious the programme should have been scrapped or the cost simply passed back to the energy companies with a zero standing for all tariffs and the cap we had before.

If the Energy companies has to use their own money they would never have done it because it was obvious it was a failure.

The most relevant figure in all of that is the £1277 cap figure you quoted. Your own costs for this winter will be significantly below this and so nowhere near a £1000 increase on what you have you have been paying. Thoughts on what longer term increases may be are speculation at this point, and in your particular situation you need to be very mindful of not thinking increases quoted in terms of typical bills apply to yourself. 

I asked above if you know your own energy use in kWh per year? I did so as looking at you will actually be paying is what to focus on. Right now I am genuinely concerned that you are putting your health at risk because of flawed assumptions that make you think the situation is far worse than it actually is. 

The difference on my spreadsheet is a little less but I still do not have the money and no way of getting it.

I'm sure an accurate calculation should be a lot less than £1000 difference though, as per my personal example numbers I posted above for you.

I don't know why you feel the need to keep getting at me, at the very best it might be £100 less and as it is over £1000 as I have shown above it will not be a lot less, it is huge.

Gerry1

Keu said:

Dolor said:

Keu said:

26. Resist until your dying breathe getting a smart meter, they are totally useless and you pay for the in house display, I mean, no sheet sherlock it uses more when the kettle is on or the washing machine.

The IHD costs the consumer less than a £1 a year to run. If you turn on a 3kW kettle or washing machine then the IHD will show high usage because it is reflecting the cost of the energy that is being used. The actual smart meter costs the consumer nothing in running costs. It is powered from the supply side of the meter.

My Kettle is shows a range of kW, not sure how that works, the IHD would tell me what I already know, a 2.5kW-3kW device uses a lot of energy but as I have shown in point 10 you can reduce that, smart meter not required, it is bleeding obvious, the ebay device is all you need, would be better if it had an app and could show usage every 15m over 24h to 7 days.

If a kettle is nominally rated at 220V - 240V 3000W (3kW) it will draw 2.52kW if the supply voltage is 220V and 3.00kW if the supply voltage is 240V.

You don't even need to buy a device to check instantaneous power consumption, just look at the red LED on the meter that's marked 1000 Imp/kWh or similar.

Expect to see between 42 and 50 flashes (impulses) per minute if absolutely nothing else is switched on and it hasn't boiled and switched itself off, pro rata for other impulse markings.

Ultrasonic

Keu said:

Ultrasonic said:

Keu said:

Ultrasonic said:

Keu said:

Ultrasonic said:

Keu said:
Even at my low usage I am facing over £1k extra on energy so those with bigger bills will be facing much more.

Are you talking about bills based on the Shell tariff you'll be moving to? If so there is no way a low energy user will have an (annual) bill increasing by anythng like as much as £1,000. If you are genuinely stressing because of this then you really don't need to. 

The move to Shell at capped Tarriff is only part of it.

Gov said last week they are adding £190 to gas bills according to radio news. There may be a reduction in Electricity but I will not benefit from it.

OFGEM predicts 30% increase in Tarriff Cap in April because it is based on what wholesalers are paying and spot rates, we are already well into the assessment period and things are not getting better, I think it could be higher than 30% but that is the amount I used.

This site says that customers of Green go from £810 to £1,277 at Shell at average will face increase of £467

moneysavingexpert.com/news/2021/09/energy-firm-gone-bust--how-your-new-firm-and-tariff-stacks-up

add 30% at £383 is £850 increase taking annual to £1660

Add the £190 takes it to £1850, so over £1000 more.

So work out your own figures because the cap is not on the amount paid it is on the tariff.

OFGEM said it would be £138 increase in Tariff cap well straight off I got hit with more than 3x that, not because I am a high energy user but because I did what we were told to do, I got a good deal.

What really pisses me off is that even if I use zero energy I still have to pay those standing charges.

OFGEM should make every supplier have to provide a zero standing charge tariff with no pre-conditions and the rate no higher than the average of all their tariffs.  At least then we could batten down the hatches and reduce our costs.

The energy companies must be laughing they got us to pay £13bn for their smart meter programme when they are the on beneficiaries, even when they botched it up with meters that turned dumb it was obvious the programme should have been scrapped or the cost simply passed back to the energy companies with a zero standing for all tariffs and the cap we had before.

If the Energy companies has to use their own money they would never have done it because it was obvious it was a failure.

The most relevant figure in all of that is the £1277 cap figure you quoted. Your own costs for this winter will be significantly below this and so nowhere near a £1000 increase on what you have you have been paying. Thoughts on what longer term increases may be are speculation at this point, and in your particular situation you need to be very mindful of not thinking increases quoted in terms of typical bills apply to yourself. 

I asked above if you know your own energy use in kWh per year? I did so as looking at you will actually be paying is what to focus on. Right now I am genuinely concerned that you are putting your health at risk because of flawed assumptions that make you think the situation is far worse than it actually is. 

The difference on my spreadsheet is a little less but I still do not have the money and no way of getting it.

I'm sure an accurate calculation should be a lot less than £1000 difference though, as per my personal example numbers I posted above for you.

I don't know why you feel the need to keep getting at me, at the very best it might be £100 less and as it is over £1000 as I have shown above it will not be a lot less, it is huge.

I'm not getting at you. I am trying to help you as I am genuinely concerned for your well-being.

As per my own example above, I struggle to see how an accurate calculation of the cost increase for you could be more than £200-£300 tops and so nowhere close to £1000. If it truly were anywhere near the £1000 figure then it would reflect a lifestyle nothing like you have described, and if this were the case then there is huge scope for a much more moderate approch to energy/money saving.

Keu

Ultrasonic said:

Keu said:

GingerTim said:

And if you really want to micro-manage your consumption, a smart meter would actually be really useful.

As I understand it, Smart Meter displays do not itemise where it is coming from, they go a lovely shade of red if you put the kettle on, once the thing knows your typical usage it will just accept your fridge usage as a baseline.  Writing usage from the device I suggest tells you what the device is using, you can compare that online, decide to replace etc.

One feature I think you may be missing is that an in-home display connected to smart meters can tell you how much money you have spent on energy in essentially real time. Pretending for a second that Pure Planet hadn't gone bust, my smart meter tells me I've spent a total of 89p so far today for example (including the standing charges). 

I guess that might be useful but it does not tell you that it is the fish tank heater or whatever, you still have to drill down and you don't need a smart meter to do that, if we learn not to buy products that use a lot of energy that will make the biggest difference.

If someone has a big family maybe they can justify one of those huge American fridges, or that range cooker but for most people they are just energy guzzlers and they cost a lot to buy too.

At the same time people on low incomes have very few choices and feel the pain more acutely. 

elsien

Not sure where the fish tank obsession is coming from  -you do keep mentioning it but homes with them are a minority. 

I don’t think I know anyone with a huge American fridge, or big range cookers either.
Yes energy costs are going to impact more on low income families but I live in a low income area and I can’t see people going to the same extremes that you are.