No completion certificate for extension

ChilliBob

We're in the process buying a property and probably at the final hurdle before exchange can be agreed. It has transpired a double height side and rear extension in 2008 has not had a completion certificate issued. 

From what I can tell this means:
1. We'd need indemnity insurance, cheap, non intrusive, just covers you if the council try to tell you off

Or

2. Retrospective sign off - but I believe this would be intrusive and involve smashing stuff around etc?!

For what it's worth we had a homebuyer survey which passed okay.


We had this a while ago when trying to purchase our first house, a loft conversion didn't have permission of sign off. The seller was hesitant to have building control come in so we swerved the property. This was about 8-9 years ago though. 

What's the current thinking here and what would you guys suggest? Our solicitor is just saying get the sellers to pay for indemnity insurance. 

ChilliBob

In addition to the above, if we wanted to do any further work to the house that needed planning permission would this cause an issue as it would be seen that permission had been granted but that completion not certified?

In essence, would an indemnity essentially mean any further work would be high risk of problems coming up, so not worth considering. 

macman

There is no connection between planning permission and building control. There are many reasons why PP might be sought and never utilised.

ChilliBob

Right so I guess that means my worry about not being able to do additional work might not be an issue. But surely if you wanted ig signed off they'd check other work?

This is a bit of an aside though, as we have no plans yet to do work (we'll, its already been extended side and back). It's more the first post that's important I suppose 

macman

I meant to add that BC enforcement can only be carried out within 12 months of the building work, so that ship has sailed long ago.  But, since the vendor will be paying, I'd ask them for an indemnity policy anyway. 
No, they don't check 'other work'. They check the work that you've applied to have regularised, nothing more. The only exception would be if they noticed something that made the building structurally dangerous.

Doozergirl

ChilliBob said:

Right so I guess that means my worry about not being able to do additional work might not be an issue. But surely if you wanted ig signed off they'd check other work?

This is a bit of an aside though, as we have no plans yet to do work (we'll, its already been extended side and back). It's more the first post that's important I suppose 

Building Control don't.   Unless there's
something really glaringly obvious that you'd want to fix anyway, but seriously cannot ever recall a BCO looking at something existing and asking for it to be upgraded.  Sign off or not.  

Building Control and Planning are totally separate departments with different jobs.  

ChilliBob

macman said:

I meant to add that BC enforcement can only be carried out within 12 months of the building work, so that ship has sailed long ago.  But, since the vendor will be paying, I'd ask them for an indemnity policy anyway. 
No, they don't check 'other work'. They check the work that you've applied to have regularised, nothing more. The only exception would be if they noticed something that made the building structurally dangerous.

Ah okay. Yeah, it looks fine go the untrained eye, and I feel sure the surveyor would have highlighted any visible red flags too - he was a private guy we found not just something from the bank etc.

I'm m not sure how this 12 months side of things comes into it? What do you mean by enforcement? I thought it was still possible, despite being 13 years on, to have retro signoff? 

ChilliBob

Doozergirl said:

ChilliBob said:

Right so I guess that means my worry about not being able to do additional work might not be an issue. But surely if you wanted ig signed off they'd check other work?

This is a bit of an aside though, as we have no plans yet to do work (we'll, its already been extended side and back). It's more the first post that's important I suppose 

Building Control don't.   Unless there's
something really glaringly obvious that you'd want to fix anyway, but seriously cannot ever recall a BCO looking at something existing and asking for it to be upgraded.  Sign off or not.  

Building Control and Planning are totally separate departments with different jobs.  

Cheers. 

So do you guys think this may be fairly common and isn't something to be overly concerned with, or is it a massive red flag? 

cx6

Could you elaborate.

1. Did the extension need PP or was it permitted development? If it needed PP, did it get it?

2. Building regs - was it ever inspected at any point whilst being build (eg foundations etc) and it is just the certificate that is missing, or were BC not even notified?

You might want to ask yourself why a completion cert wasn't provided and therefore exactly how it was built. I would not buy a house with a double height extension without some proof it was built properly.

This is also something you would have to mention when taking out house insurance.

ChilliBob

Yep, it needed planning permission, it's pretty extensive, and yes planning permission was granted. 

I don't know the answer to 2. I'm afraid, and I guess any answer we do get we would have to just take on trust? Or, are BC inspections recorded (even typing that sounds stupid, I'm sure they are!).

Section62

ChilliBob said:

Yep, it needed planning permission, it's pretty extensive, and yes planning permission was granted. 

I don't know the answer to 2. I'm afraid, and I guess any answer we do get we would have to just take on trust? Or, are BC inspections recorded (even typing that sounds stupid, I'm sure they are!).

Although planning and building control are two separate departments, they are (usually) run by one organisation.

The two departments (sometimes) share data, sometimes using a common system to record and process applications.

If you made a future application for PP for other work, that might raise awareness of a non-closed BC case.  It also puts you on shaky ground with the indemnity policy if there is a requirement not to contact the organisation rather than not contacting BC.


If BC did originally open a case for the work, the casefile will contain records of documents sent/received and of site visits. But unless your council is one that has all this information available online, you aren't going to be able to find out without contacting the council, which would almost certainly invalidate any indemnity policy.

FWIW, if it was a single-storey extension which had PP but not BC sign off then I personally would probably go ahead subject to having a good survey, and preferably some evidence (pictures etc) of the work being done.  I'd also want the vendor to pay for a drainage survey in any event.

But an extensive two-storey extension without BC sign off... that would make me a very nervous buyer.