Bespoke Sofa unsuitable

neilmcl

ItsComingRome said:

neilmcl said:

ItsComingRome said:

neilmcl said:

ItsComingRome said:

photome said:

4.3 in their t and c 

To cancel a Contract, you must inform us in writing, by post to Denelli Italia, 10 Tanners Drive, Milton Keynes, MK14 5BW or by email to info@denelli.co.uk You must also return the Product(s) to us at [Denelli Italia, 10 Tanners Drive, Milton Keynes, MK14 5BW] within 14 days of notifying us in writing that you wish to cancel the contract, in a new and unused condition and in the original packaging, and at your own cost and risk. Your refund will be in full and will be made within 14 days of us receiving the Products. You have a legal obligation to take reasonable care of the Products while they are in your possession. This does not apply to orders placed in store in our showroom.


no mention of restocking fees there although it does say you need to pay to return , which IMO is wrong as it’s not what you ordered

Thankfully your opinion doesn't matter, the law does. The OP needs to be reimbursed for the cost of delivery but it's entirely legal for the cost of returning the item to be borne by the purchaser.

I think you're missing his point. As we've already said if the OP had rejected the sofa via the CRA route, as it's not as ordered (potentially), then it would be wrong for them to charge for a return.

I'm not missing any point. The OP said it would be easier to cancel via the CCR, and intends on doing so. It's entirely legal for the consumer to bear the cost of returning it under those regulations.

And it still doesn't matter what anyone's opinion on this is.

Well actually it does because it is wrong that the OP has to pay for returning something that isn't what was ordered, that fact that they're going down the CCR route rather than the CRA route doesn't negate that opinion.

It's not wrong if they return it under the CCRs.  That's the law.

They have the option of returning it under the CRA and not paying for the return. In order to do that they may face an uphill battle of trying to prove it isn't what they ordered.  That's the cost of making vague "I want that one" orders instead of asking for exactly what you want.

And we've already been through and clearly explained this!

ItsComingRome

neilmcl said:

ItsComingRome said:

neilmcl said:

ItsComingRome said:

neilmcl said:

ItsComingRome said:

photome said:

4.3 in their t and c 

To cancel a Contract, you must inform us in writing, by post to Denelli Italia, 10 Tanners Drive, Milton Keynes, MK14 5BW or by email to info@denelli.co.uk You must also return the Product(s) to us at [Denelli Italia, 10 Tanners Drive, Milton Keynes, MK14 5BW] within 14 days of notifying us in writing that you wish to cancel the contract, in a new and unused condition and in the original packaging, and at your own cost and risk. Your refund will be in full and will be made within 14 days of us receiving the Products. You have a legal obligation to take reasonable care of the Products while they are in your possession. This does not apply to orders placed in store in our showroom.


no mention of restocking fees there although it does say you need to pay to return , which IMO is wrong as it’s not what you ordered

Thankfully your opinion doesn't matter, the law does. The OP needs to be reimbursed for the cost of delivery but it's entirely legal for the cost of returning the item to be borne by the purchaser.

I think you're missing his point. As we've already said if the OP had rejected the sofa via the CRA route, as it's not as ordered (potentially), then it would be wrong for them to charge for a return.

I'm not missing any point. The OP said it would be easier to cancel via the CCR, and intends on doing so. It's entirely legal for the consumer to bear the cost of returning it under those regulations.

And it still doesn't matter what anyone's opinion on this is.

Well actually it does because it is wrong that the OP has to pay for returning something that isn't what was ordered, that fact that they're going down the CCR route rather than the CRA route doesn't negate that opinion.

It's not wrong if they return it under the CCRs.  That's the law.

They have the option of returning it under the CRA and not paying for the return. In order to do that they may face an uphill battle of trying to prove it isn't what they ordered.  That's the cost of making vague "I want that one" orders instead of asking for exactly what you want.

And we've already been through and clearly explained this!

I didn't say otherwise.

LynnSG

neilmcl said:

ItsComingRome said:

neilmcl said:

ItsComingRome said:

neilmcl said:

ItsComingRome said:

photome said:

4.3 in their t and c 

To cancel a Contract, you must inform us in writing, by post to Denelli Italia, 10 Tanners Drive, Milton Keynes, MK14 5BW or by email to info@denelli.co.uk You must also return the Product(s) to us at [Denelli Italia, 10 Tanners Drive, Milton Keynes, MK14 5BW] within 14 days of notifying us in writing that you wish to cancel the contract, in a new and unused condition and in the original packaging, and at your own cost and risk. Your refund will be in full and will be made within 14 days of us receiving the Products. You have a legal obligation to take reasonable care of the Products while they are in your possession. This does not apply to orders placed in store in our showroom.


no mention of restocking fees there although it does say you need to pay to return , which IMO is wrong as it’s not what you ordered

Thankfully your opinion doesn't matter, the law does. The OP needs to be reimbursed for the cost of delivery but it's entirely legal for the cost of returning the item to be borne by the purchaser.

I think you're missing his point. As we've already said if the OP had rejected the sofa via the CRA route, as it's not as ordered (potentially), then it would be wrong for them to charge for a return.

I'm not missing any point. The OP said it would be easier to cancel via the CCR, and intends on doing so. It's entirely legal for the consumer to bear the cost of returning it under those regulations.

And it still doesn't matter what anyone's opinion on this is.

Well actually it does because it is wrong that the OP has to pay for returning something that isn't what was ordered, that fact that they're going down the CCR route rather than the CRA route doesn't negate that opinion.

It's not wrong if they return it under the CCRs.  That's the law.

They have the option of returning it under the CRA and not paying for the return. In order to do that they may face an uphill battle of trying to prove it isn't what they ordered.  That's the cost of making vague "I want that one" orders instead of asking for exactly what you want.

And we've already been through and clearly explained this!

With due respect, we didn't make a vague "I want that one" order. You don't know the full story, as you weren't there.  The website is very misleading, so for clarity we asked for the one in the only configuration shown on the website. And the salesperson then placed the order. We gave dimensions etc... and asked them to order a longer left sided sofa. 
And then the delivery note shows a different pictorial configuration to the one delivered. Please don't think it's as simple as an impulsive " I want that one" decision. It wasn't. And it was during lockdown when we couldn't visit the showroom. We truly haven't got £3000 to throw away on an impulsive decision and we are both educated intelligent people 

Grumpy_chap

As I understand it, the supplier has advised the OP that a return under CCR will be subject to the restocking charge (£680) but not mentioned what the collection costs will be.

It may be that the supplier will organise the collection for free - inline with the "free delivery" prominently promoted across the website.  The T's&C's don't seem to say what the collection cost will be.  Maybe the OP can update what has been advised about collection costs?

If the sofa is collected and collection not charged for, but then the "restocking charge" is applied, I'd say the OP gets full refund as the restocking charge can be challenged and the supplier cannot then reasonably apply a retrospective collection charge.

Just my take, though.

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head

Worth a note that for goods which can not be returned by normal post the trader should advise of the cost of return and if they fail to do so the consumer is not to bear the return costs. 

This relates to the durable information provided which OP would need to check.

I don't see how a % deduction bears a relation to the cost of he return.

This applies if the contract was governed by the laws of England & Wales or, most likely, any EU member state. 


www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2013/3134/regulation/35/made

(4) The consumer must send off the goods under paragraph (2)(a), or hand them over under paragraph (2)(b), without undue delay and in any event not later than 14 days after the day on which the consumer informs the trader as required by regulation 32(2).

(5) The consumer must bear the direct cost of returning goods under paragraph (2), unless—

(a)the trader has agreed to bear those costs, or

(b)the trader failed to provide the consumer with the information about the consumer bearing those costs, required by paragraph (m) of Schedule 2, in accordance with Part 2.

www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2013/3134/schedule/2/made

(m)where applicable, that the consumer will have to bear the cost of returning the goods in case of cancellation and, for distance contracts, if the goods, by their nature, cannot normally be returned by post, the cost of returning the goods;

LynnSG

Grumpy_chap said:

As I understand it, the supplier has advised the OP that a return under CCR will be subject to the restocking charge (£680) but not mentioned what the collection costs will be.

It may be that the supplier will organise the collection for free - inline with the "free delivery" prominently promoted across the website.  The T's&C's don't seem to say what the collection cost will be.  Maybe the OP can update what has been advised about collection costs?

If the sofa is collected and collection not charged for, but then the "restocking charge" is applied, I'd say the OP gets full refund as the restocking charge can be challenged and the supplier cannot then reasonably apply a retrospective collection charge.

Just my take, though.

Thanks again. I will phone the company tomorrow - emailing can often result in misinterpretation and crossed wires - a bit like in this forum! We have the email ready to send, but will ask specifically what the return costs are. Actually, we just want a replacement sofa in the configuration / dimensions that fit our room, no matter what nomenclature is used! Very loathe to use this company again, but it's the only way to get the sofa we want - we've looked everywhere else. Sigh....why is life so complicated!? 

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head

LynnSG said:

Grumpy_chap said:

As I understand it, the supplier has advised the OP that a return under CCR will be subject to the restocking charge (£680) but not mentioned what the collection costs will be.

It may be that the supplier will organise the collection for free - inline with the "free delivery" prominently promoted across the website.  The T's&C's don't seem to say what the collection cost will be.  Maybe the OP can update what has been advised about collection costs?

If the sofa is collected and collection not charged for, but then the "restocking charge" is applied, I'd say the OP gets full refund as the restocking charge can be challenged and the supplier cannot then reasonably apply a retrospective collection charge.

Just my take, though.

Thanks again. I will phone the company tomorrow - emailing can often result in misinterpretation and crossed wires - a bit like in this forum! We have the email ready to send, but will ask specifically what the return costs are. Actually, we just want a replacement sofa in the configuration / dimensions that fit our room, no matter what nomenclature is used! Very loathe to use this company again, but it's the only way to get the sofa we want - we've looked everywhere else. Sigh....why is life so complicated!? 

Don't ask this, after checking all the written info you have (excluding the info on their website) to make sure, just advise that as they haven't provided the cost of return they are to bear this.

neilmcl

LynnSG said:

neilmcl said:

ItsComingRome said:

neilmcl said:

ItsComingRome said:

neilmcl said:

ItsComingRome said:

photome said:

4.3 in their t and c 

To cancel a Contract, you must inform us in writing, by post to Denelli Italia, 10 Tanners Drive, Milton Keynes, MK14 5BW or by email to info@denelli.co.uk You must also return the Product(s) to us at [Denelli Italia, 10 Tanners Drive, Milton Keynes, MK14 5BW] within 14 days of notifying us in writing that you wish to cancel the contract, in a new and unused condition and in the original packaging, and at your own cost and risk. Your refund will be in full and will be made within 14 days of us receiving the Products. You have a legal obligation to take reasonable care of the Products while they are in your possession. This does not apply to orders placed in store in our showroom.


no mention of restocking fees there although it does say you need to pay to return , which IMO is wrong as it’s not what you ordered

Thankfully your opinion doesn't matter, the law does. The OP needs to be reimbursed for the cost of delivery but it's entirely legal for the cost of returning the item to be borne by the purchaser.

I think you're missing his point. As we've already said if the OP had rejected the sofa via the CRA route, as it's not as ordered (potentially), then it would be wrong for them to charge for a return.

I'm not missing any point. The OP said it would be easier to cancel via the CCR, and intends on doing so. It's entirely legal for the consumer to bear the cost of returning it under those regulations.

And it still doesn't matter what anyone's opinion on this is.

Well actually it does because it is wrong that the OP has to pay for returning something that isn't what was ordered, that fact that they're going down the CCR route rather than the CRA route doesn't negate that opinion.

It's not wrong if they return it under the CCRs.  That's the law.

They have the option of returning it under the CRA and not paying for the return. In order to do that they may face an uphill battle of trying to prove it isn't what they ordered.  That's the cost of making vague "I want that one" orders instead of asking for exactly what you want.

And we've already been through and clearly explained this!

With due respect, we didn't make a vague "I want that one" order. You don't know the full story, as you weren't there.  The website is very misleading, so for clarity we asked for the one in the only configuration shown on the website. And the salesperson then placed the order. We gave dimensions etc... and asked them to order a longer left sided sofa. 
And then the delivery note shows a different pictorial configuration to the one delivered. Please don't think it's as simple as an impulsive " I want that one" decision. It wasn't. And it was during lockdown when we couldn't visit the showroom. We truly haven't got £3000 to throw away on an impulsive decision and we are both educated intelligent people 

I think you're replying to the wrong person.

Grumpy_chap

LynnSG said:

Thanks again. I will phone the company tomorrow - emailing can often result in misinterpretation and crossed wires - a bit like in this forum! We have the email ready to send, but will ask specifically what the return costs are. Actually, we just want a replacement sofa in the configuration / dimensions that fit our room, no matter what nomenclature is used! Very loathe to use this company again, but it's the only way to get the sofa we want - we've looked everywhere else. Sigh....why is life so complicated!? 

Don't ask and don't phone.

Simply send an e-mail as per the T's&C's:
https://www.denelli.co.uk/terms-and-conditions 
4.3  To cancel a Contract, you must inform us in writing, by post to Denelli Italia, 10 Tanners Drive, Milton Keynes, MK14 5BW or by email to info@denelli.co.uk 

Keep the e-mail as short and factual as possible.  Do not get drawn into reasons etc.  All you want to say is along the following lines:

Dear lovely Dunelli sofa people,

I received my sofa under order number XXX on YYY date.
I wish to cancel the contract and am doing so as within 14 days of delivery (today's date being ZZZ).
I look forward to your confirmation of the arrangements for your collection of the sofa.
I await my full refund.

Love, hugs & big sloppy kisses.
LynnSG

You may wish to phrase as you would rather than the typical grumpy chap, but really say nothing that does not have to be said.
Let them collect the sofa.
Get the refund for the majority of the payment.
Then if you did not get a 100% refund, lodge a complaint for refund of the return carriage costs and / or restocking charge or whatever.
If the complaint does not then yield the 100% refund, lodge S75 (not chargeback) via the CC that you paid some of the cost against.

LynnSG

neilmcl said:

LynnSG said:

neilmcl said:

ItsComingRome said:

neilmcl said:

ItsComingRome said:

neilmcl said:

ItsComingRome said:

photome said:

4.3 in their t and c 

To cancel a Contract, you must inform us in writing, by post to Denelli Italia, 10 Tanners Drive, Milton Keynes, MK14 5BW or by email to info@denelli.co.uk You must also return the Product(s) to us at [Denelli Italia, 10 Tanners Drive, Milton Keynes, MK14 5BW] within 14 days of notifying us in writing that you wish to cancel the contract, in a new and unused condition and in the original packaging, and at your own cost and risk. Your refund will be in full and will be made within 14 days of us receiving the Products. You have a legal obligation to take reasonable care of the Products while they are in your possession. This does not apply to orders placed in store in our showroom.


no mention of restocking fees there although it does say you need to pay to return , which IMO is wrong as it’s not what you ordered

Thankfully your opinion doesn't matter, the law does. The OP needs to be reimbursed for the cost of delivery but it's entirely legal for the cost of returning the item to be borne by the purchaser.

I think you're missing his point. As we've already said if the OP had rejected the sofa via the CRA route, as it's not as ordered (potentially), then it would be wrong for them to charge for a return.

I'm not missing any point. The OP said it would be easier to cancel via the CCR, and intends on doing so. It's entirely legal for the consumer to bear the cost of returning it under those regulations.

And it still doesn't matter what anyone's opinion on this is.

Well actually it does because it is wrong that the OP has to pay for returning something that isn't what was ordered, that fact that they're going down the CCR route rather than the CRA route doesn't negate that opinion.

It's not wrong if they return it under the CCRs.  That's the law.

They have the option of returning it under the CRA and not paying for the return. In order to do that they may face an uphill battle of trying to prove it isn't what they ordered.  That's the cost of making vague "I want that one" orders instead of asking for exactly what you want.

And we've already been through and clearly explained this!

With due respect, we didn't make a vague "I want that one" order. You don't know the full story, as you weren't there.  The website is very misleading, so for clarity we asked for the one in the only configuration shown on the website. And the salesperson then placed the order. We gave dimensions etc... and asked them to order a longer left sided sofa. 
And then the delivery note shows a different pictorial configuration to the one delivered. Please don't think it's as simple as an impulsive " I want that one" decision. It wasn't. And it was during lockdown when we couldn't visit the showroom. We truly haven't got £3000 to throw away on an impulsive decision and we are both educated intelligent people 

I think you're replying to the wrong person.

Am I? Sorry . First time using this forum - not as nimble negotiating the posts as I should be yet