I'm taking Ryanair through the small claims court

Markh5096

Posting this in case any MSE Forum members also find themselves in Court action with Ryanair.

My case was due to be heard in Manchester County Court today, but a Court !!!!!!-up meant that it wasn't. I now have to wait for a new date. Anyway....

In June 2020 I booked flights for 4 to Tenerife (to fly on Dec 23 2020), at a cost of £2,700. The days leading up to the flight was the time when other countries were intoducing rules prohibiting UK nationals from entering.

On 22 December I noted the following statement on Ryanair's website - "Flights To/From UK 20th-24th Dec”, that “For any flights to/from the UK in the coming days (Dec 20th to 24th) which are banned by EU Govts regulation, all affected customers will receive an email notification and they will be offered practical alternatives including free moves, re-routing or a refund if they so wish.”

On 22 December Spain (and therefore Tenerife) joined the list of countries banning UK nationals from entering. I duly received an email from Ryanair advising me that we would not be allowed to board the flight. Needless to say, we did not travel to the airport.

Ryanair have refused a refund. They merely offered a one-off flight change, to be effected by 31 March 2021. For numerous valid reasons this was not acceptable, not least because any shortfall in the value of the re-arranged flights (compared to the original flights) would be lost.

I initiated a claim via the small claims court, which Ryanair are defending, using a London based firm of solicitors. They have filed a defence, and a witness statement, and they had a senior barrister arrive at the Manchester Court for the aborted hearing today. So they are full guns blazing. I'm representing myself, as legal fees would not be recoverable.

Ryanair's defence is based around their Ts&Cs, which do not specify that a refund should be given in these circumstances. They did not cancel the flight, as it still took place, albeit with only five Spanish nationals as passengers. They also argue that the 'Preventing boarding' provisions don't apply because we didn't present at check-in (why would you, when you've been told you won't be able to board??).

Of course I'm hoping that common sense and justice will prevail. I've paid £2,700 to Ryanair (which means a very significant profit for them), and had nothing in return. I'll put up an update to this post in due course, but wondering if any other forum members have had similar experience, or have any tips.

Caz3121

did you try claiming from your travel insurance or did it not cover the situation?
might also be worth seeing if there is any update to this - https://www.gov.uk/government/news/cma-launches-action-against-british-airways-and-ryanair-over-refunds

Markh5096

Hi Caz, thanks. No, it wasn't covered (or rather, it was excluded) from my travel insurance. Thanks also for the link to the CMA action, I actually quoted the head of the CMA in my Witness Statement!

Thrugelmir

Markh5096 said:

Of course I'm hoping that common sense and justice will prevail. I've paid £2,700 to Ryanair (which means a very significant profit for them),

The plane flew all the majority of the normal costs were incurred. Ryanair lost €815 million in their last financial year. With a further loss of €273 million in the quarter to 30th June. Any profit made on your booking pales into insignificance with figures of this magnitude. Reimbursement to customers as a principle would tip them over the edge I'd say. 

eskbanker

Markh5096 said:

On 22 December I noted the following statement on Ryanair's website - "Flights To/From UK 20th-24th Dec”, that “For any flights to/from the UK in the coming days (Dec 20th to 24th) which are banned by EU Govts regulation, all affected customers will receive an email notification and they will be offered practical alternatives including free moves, re-routing or a refund if they so wish.”

The statement doesn't appear to be accessible anymore but was widely quoted on other sites, and importantly the rest of it distinguishes between flights being cancelled (bookings on which qualify for refunds) and flights still operating (bookings on which don't qualify for refunds), so they did seem to make it clear that you'd only be entitled to a free rebooking up to March 2021 if the flight operated:

Ryanair has posted the following advice on its website:

“For any flights to/from the UK in the coming days (Dec 20th to 24th) which are banned by EU Govts regulation, all affected customers will receive an email notification and they will be offered practical alternatives including free moves (no change fee applies) or refunds if they so wish.

“In the case of all other flights to/from the UK which are permitted to fly, Ryanair will operate these flights to facilitate all passengers who need to travel for business reasons, and are booked on them or wish to move to these flights.

If any such passengers (booked on operating flights) do not wish to travel during the next 5 days prior to Christmas, then Ryanair will facilitate a free move of their booking (no change fee applies) to any date up to 15th Mar.”

That's not to say that you can't construct a case that they breached the EC 261/2004 regulations (what exactly did their 22/23 December email say about your options?), but it does sound like they acted in accordance with their published statement....

ginger_chocolate

Just came here to say good luck. Hope you get your money.

Markh5096

Thrugelmir said:

Markh5096 said:

Of course I'm hoping that common sense and justice will prevail. I've paid £2,700 to Ryanair (which means a very significant profit for them),

The plane flew all the majority of the normal costs were incurred. Ryanair lost €815 million in their last financial year. With a further loss of €273 million in the quarter to 30th June. Any profit made on your booking pales into insignificance with figures of this magnitude. Reimbursement to customers as a principle would tip them over the edge I'd say. 

So I should be expected to forego £2,700 by way of my contribution to the "Save Ryanair fund"?

bagand96

Ryanair will defend this robustly. Forgetting the fact that it's Ryanair for a moment, any airline would defend this robustly.

The case hinges on the question of whether an airline should be made to refund passengers who can't travel due to Government regulations outside of the airline's or passenger's control.

Whilst the Spanish Government's actions weren't your fault, they weren't the airline's either, so with a non-refundable ticket Ryanair have followed their T& C's.

It would usually be a travel insurance claim, but in the middle of the pandemic many policies did not cover this. 

It's been a much debated scenario and the CMA have made a lot of noise themselves although they don't seem to have the enforcement powers to back up their viewpoint.

To my knowledge I've not heard of any rulings/judgements anywhere that force an airline to refund in this case.  I'd speculate that if airline's had been forced I to refunds the last 18 months then we might have less airlines left now than we have energy suppliers.

It will be very interesting to follow the outcome of the case.

mattyprice4004

I'm interested to see the outcome, but they wouldn't throw the resources they are at the case if they didn't think they'd win. 
Ultimately if Spain said you can't enter, that's not Ryanair's fault - so while £2,700 is a lot to lose, the airline aren't responsible for taking the hit either. 

Sorry, but while I'm not the biggest Ryanair fan I think you'll come away without your money. 

Markh5096

bagand96 said:

Ryanair will defend this robustly. Forgetting the fact that it's Ryanair for a moment, any airline would defend this robustly.

The case hinges on the question of whether an airline should be made to refund passengers who can't travel due to Government regulations outside of the airline's or passenger's control.

Whilst the Spanish Government's actions weren't your fault, they weren't the airline's either, so with a non-refundable ticket Ryanair have followed their T& C's.

It would usually be a travel insurance claim, but in the middle of the pandemic many policies did not cover this. 

It's been a much debated scenario and the CMA have made a lot of noise themselves although they don't seem to have the enforcement powers to back up their viewpoint.

To my knowledge I've not heard of any rulings/judgements anywhere that force an airline to refund in this case.  I'd speculate that if airline's had been forced I to refunds the last 18 months then we might have less airlines left now than we have energy suppliers.

It will be very interesting to follow the outcome of the case.

Thanks for taking the time to provide your input. What do you think of "the contract was frustrated" argument?

I think one of the problems is that we are faced with a "100% either way" scenario - either I lose out fully, or Ryanair do. The issue is compounded by the fact that we were flying at a particularly expensive time of year, so in my ticket price was a very large element of "demand driven profit", and much less covering of the actual costs Ryanair incurred.

Ryanair flatly refused to engage in mediation, at which point any sympathy I may have had evaporated.

Markh5096

mattyprice4004 said:

I'm interested to see the outcome, but they wouldn't throw the resources they are at the case if they didn't think they'd win. 
Ultimately if Spain said you can't enter, that's not Ryanair's fault - so while £2,700 is a lot to lose, the airline aren't responsible for taking the hit either. 

Sorry, but while I'm not the biggest Ryanair fan I think you'll come away without your money. 

Thanks for taking the time to comment Matty. As I've just put on another comment, Ryanair flatly refused to engage in mediation, at which point any sympathy I may have had for them and their position evaporated.

They are very well known for adopting bullying tactics, including threatening me with "seeking an award for their costs by way of my unreasonable behaviour" in their defence.