Speeding and Driving without due care

TooManyPoints

So fine for both offences. is there guidelines on how much the fine is for each one?  Providing your income details/employment is options but i think if you don't then do they just go for maximum fine?

Fines are based on multiples of your weekly income. The speeding fine should see a fine of a week's net income; the Careless Driving either 0.5, 1.0 or 1.5 weeks, depending on how serious the court views the offence. Fines will be reduced by a third for a guilty plea. If they have no information about your income, the court will use a default figure of £440pw.

Costs following a Newton Hearing are usually the same s for a guilty plea (£85) but the prosecution may ask for more if they have to provide expert testimony.

It is not within Magistrates' powers to drop charges. The charges are brought by whoever is prosecuting and it is their decision whether to proceed or not. 

scrappy_returns

shrimptiger said:

TooManyPoints said:

Therefore how can the single magistrate judge the severity without looking at the evidence?

He could plead guilty but dispute the facts. If they decide there would be such a difference, they order a “Newton Hearing” to establish the facts that will be used for sentencing. None of this would be heard by a Single Justice but it would be put before a normal court.

. There will be a fine for each offence (though the "totality" principle which Car54 mentions may have an influence), a victim surcharge of 10% of one of the fines (the highest if they are different) and £85 costs (assuming a guilty plea)..

Oh ok so i cannot request a netwon (they may ask for this?)  hearing and there is no option to plead guilty but dispute facts so i am guessing I would it would be ticking teh guilty box, and then explaining in the details box that you do not aggree with the facts. Anyone done this online before? Does it give you enough space for details?

So fine for both offences. is there guidelines on how much the fine is for each one?  Providing your income details/employment is options but i think if you don't then do they just go for maximum fine?

Also, if i were to plead guilty to speeding but not guilty to DWCA, does that automatically go to court, or does the single magistrate then decide if they are happy to punish for the speeding and drop the DWDCA?

Would your defence be "I was driving so fast it took all my care and attention"?

shrimptiger

scrappy_returns said:

shrimptiger said:

TooManyPoints said:

Therefore how can the single magistrate judge the severity without looking at the evidence?

He could plead guilty but dispute the facts. If they decide there would be such a difference, they order a “Newton Hearing” to establish the facts that will be used for sentencing. None of this would be heard by a Single Justice but it would be put before a normal court.

. There will be a fine for each offence (though the "totality" principle which Car54 mentions may have an influence), a victim surcharge of 10% of one of the fines (the highest if they are different) and £85 costs (assuming a guilty plea)..

Oh ok so i cannot request a netwon (they may ask for this?)  hearing and there is no option to plead guilty but dispute facts so i am guessing I would it would be ticking teh guilty box, and then explaining in the details box that you do not aggree with the facts. Anyone done this online before? Does it give you enough space for details?

So fine for both offences. is there guidelines on how much the fine is for each one?  Providing your income details/employment is options but i think if you don't then do they just go for maximum fine?

Also, if i were to plead guilty to speeding but not guilty to DWCA, does that automatically go to court, or does the single magistrate then decide if they are happy to punish for the speeding and drop the DWDCA?

Would your defence be "I was driving so fast it took all my care and attention"?

Urm, i wasn't driving so fast at that point so the sarcastic comment from you is not necessary. thanks

shrimptiger

TooManyPoints said:

So fine for both offences. is there guidelines on how much the fine is for each one?  Providing your income details/employment is options but i think if you don't then do they just go for maximum fine?

Fines are based on multiples of your weekly income. The speeding fine should see a fine of a week's net income; the Careless Driving either 0.5, 1.0 or 1.5 weeks, depending on how serious the court views the offence. Fines will be reduced by a third for a guilty plea. If they have no information about your income, the court will use a default figure of £440pw.

Costs following a Newton Hearing are usually the same s for a guilty plea (£85) but the prosecution may ask for more if they have to provide expert testimony.

It is not within Magistrates' powers to drop charges. The charges are brought by whoever is prosecuting and it is their decision whether to proceed or not. 

Thanks for your advice and information. I thought it was in the magistrates power but good to know. Thanks again for taking the time with the detailed replies. 

scrappy_returns

shrimptiger said:

scrappy_returns said:

shrimptiger said:

TooManyPoints said:

Therefore how can the single magistrate judge the severity without looking at the evidence?

He could plead guilty but dispute the facts. If they decide there would be such a difference, they order a “Newton Hearing” to establish the facts that will be used for sentencing. None of this would be heard by a Single Justice but it would be put before a normal court.

. There will be a fine for each offence (though the "totality" principle which Car54 mentions may have an influence), a victim surcharge of 10% of one of the fines (the highest if they are different) and £85 costs (assuming a guilty plea)..

Oh ok so i cannot request a netwon (they may ask for this?)  hearing and there is no option to plead guilty but dispute facts so i am guessing I would it would be ticking teh guilty box, and then explaining in the details box that you do not aggree with the facts. Anyone done this online before? Does it give you enough space for details?

So fine for both offences. is there guidelines on how much the fine is for each one?  Providing your income details/employment is options but i think if you don't then do they just go for maximum fine?

Also, if i were to plead guilty to speeding but not guilty to DWCA, does that automatically go to court, or does the single magistrate then decide if they are happy to punish for the speeding and drop the DWDCA?

Would your defence be "I was driving so fast it took all my care and attention"?

Urm, i wasn't driving so fast at that point so the sarcastic comment from you is not necessary. thanks

So that's the defence, the police got it wrong

shrimptiger

One thing i dont understand is why they don't just give you a ticket for speeding on the spot? :S

ontheroad1970

shrimptiger said:

One thing i dont understand is why they don't just give you a ticket for speeding on the spot? :S

On the spot tickets don't exist.  That's just The Sun/Mail simplifying things.  They will normally Traffic Offence Report, with a letter coming in due course.

shrimptiger

So for the DWDCA, i seriously don't think i am at fault. Speeding, maybe slightly over yes (i mean i don't remember but on an a road with a 50mph limit, and overtaking).

If i plead not guilty to the DWDCA it goes to court and i get a court date, and they send the evidence, and it looks like, even a minor offence looking at the video, can i then change plea to guilty and NOT go to the hassle of going to court and of course the court fees? 

Thansk again for your inputs

Car_54

shrimptiger said:

So for the DWDCA, i seriously don't think i am at fault. Speeding, maybe slightly over yes (i mean i don't remember but on an a road with a 50mph limit, and overtaking).

If i plead not guilty to the DWDCA it goes to court and i get a court date, and they send the evidence, and it looks like, even a minor offence looking at the video, can i then change plea to guilty and NOT go to the hassle of going to court and of course the court fees? 

Thansk again for your inputs

You can certainly change your plea. There are no court fees, and AFAIK the prosecution won't claim costs.

[Deleted User]

ontheroad1970 said:

[Deleted User] said:

It's a stitch up. They know it's basically impossible to prove you weren't speeding (unless you have a dashcam with speed display) and their speed guns are janky nonsense. If you want you to be speeding they just point the gun in the wrong place until it reads over the limit.

You are stuffed I'm afraid. Get a dashcam with GPS and speed display, it's the only defense against false accusations.

GPS won't save you, as the speed on it isn't live.  So I'd check what you hear from down the pub, if I were you.  Try bringing the GPS enabled files, and you'll be laughed out of court and given an eye watering bill for their expert, on top of a fine and a £620 not guilty costs.

What do you mean "isn't live"? It records the speed every second, or every 10th of a second on some units, based on distance travelled. It's highly accurate too, a few orders of magnitude better than a speed gun and better than car speedometers.

People have used GPS evidence to overcome accusations of speeding before. At the very least, it creates significant doubt and means that the speed gun evidence alone is not enough to reach the threshold of "beyond reasonable doubt".