Pcn from UKPC

anyhelpwilldo

Hi 
The driver of a hired vehicle (van) received a PCN from UKPC yesterday 28/09/21. 

The driver parked in The Colindale retail park just of the A5 Edgware Road to visit Go Outdoors, this was around 17:05 ( car park virtually empty)
Noticing the UKPC sign he saw in large writing “ 2 hours maximum stay “ he failed to notice the smaller print which said : Important: If you leave this site whilst this vehicle remains in the car park you may be liable to receive a parking charge. 

A PCN was issued at 17:16 stating the driver allegedly left the site. After leaving Go Outdoors and 

returning to the vehicle within the hour he noticed the ticket attached to the windshield and left the site. 

The driver contacted Go Outdoors regarding the issue but they said it was out of their control. 

The driver has subsequently lost the PCN notice ( mistakenly thrown away with food packaging).
The driver has informed the hirer and the lease company of the situation and requested them not to 
pay any payments regarding this matter at this moment. 

This is the sign at the car park. 

Doesn’t seem to be any ANPR cameras at the location. 

Any advice on the next step to take. 

Thanks. 

Redx

Is UKPC , not pcuk !!  BPA AOS member , so read and follow the advice in the newbies FAQ sticky thread near the top of the forum , appealing as keeper hirer , if they don't know who was driving ( keep it that way ) , once the hire company has named the hirer and they receive a postal NTH in a few weeks time

The hire templates etc by Edna basher are at the bottom of the first post in the newbies FAQ sticky thread

UKPC will fail POFA , no hire docs , easy to win as as hirer , but no blabbing about who was driving

Coupon-mad

What a mess.  He has lost the PCN so can't appeal, so the next thing will be £170 demand threatening the hire firm with court.  They'll panic and pay, regardless of him telling them not to.

He could email a SAR quickly to the DPO, unless you mean the only PCN has the company name on, not his?   If they haven't named him as hirer yet, they should...but how can they if he's lost the PCN?

anyhelpwilldo

Yes UKPC 
With the sign saying “may be liable “ does this mean that not all instances are liable ? 

How would anyone know if they are liable when they use that phrase?
Yes it is a mess Coupon-mad 

D_P_Dance

so the next thing will be £170 demand threatening ,,,

That would be unlawful,, read this,

Excel v Wilkinson

At the Bradford County Court, District Judge Claire Jackson (now HHJ Jackson, a Specialist Civil Circuit Judge) decided to hear a 'test case' a few months ago, where £60 had been added to a parking charge despite Judges up and down the country repeatedly disallowing that sum and warning parking firms not to waste court time with such spurious claims.   That case was Excel v Wilkinson: G4QZ465V, heard in July 2020 and leave to appeal was refused and that route was not pursued.  The Judge concluded that such claims are proceedings with 'an improper collateral purpose'.   This Judge - and others who have since copied her words and struck dozens of cases out in late 2020 and into 2021 - went into significant detail and concluded that parking operators (such as this Claimant) are seeking to circumvent CPR 27.14 as well as breaching the Consumer Rights Act 2015.   DJ Hickinbottom has recently struck more cases out in that court area, stating: ''I find that striking out this claim is the only appropriate manner in which the disapproval of the court can be shown''.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/16qovzulab1szem/G4QZ465V%20Excel%20v%20Wilkinson.pdf?dl=0

and this

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3229165/Is-PROOF-private-parking-firms-scamming-motorists-Drivers-say-timings-photos-doctored-legally-parked-cars-issued-fines.html

and complain to your MP.  

 

anyhelpwilldo

After speaking with the driver they said that before they lost the PCN notice that they actually responded to the PCN by going to their appeals page and inputting the reference number , a photograph of the rear of the vehicle was all that was there, they then did not continue and had no more correspondence and exited the web page. 

Is this information of any use ?

Coupon-mad

Nope. They need to get a copy but you still haven't said if the company gave his name and address or if the only PCN letter was addressed to the keeper company?

He could email UKPC with the VRM and name of his company and the location of alleged contravention, pretending he wants to review the images with a view to considering paying the PCN or naming the driver...but saying the company has mislaid the PCN front page and could they kindly supply a copy or at least the PCN number so he can look at the photos and make an informed decision.

Obviously I am NOT saying he should pay or name the driver!  But use the words above, not just "I've lost the PCN".

My suggestion has worked before and is a way to get UKPC to cough up the PCN number in the hope of duping a victim into paying:

appealmoreinfo@ukparkingcontrol.com

fisherjim

Of course they will pursue it they are greedy scammers in an unregulated industry and the leaving site ruse is just an add on way of extorting cash from victims that cave in and cough up.

These leaving site claims rarely go to court, the weasel UKPC employee or profit centre as they call them will have been hiding in his van or behind a hedge. 

But you need to keep on top of it and stop making silly mistakes facts are key, how on earth you can twice mistake UKPC for PCUK I don't know.

anyhelpwilldo

Coupon-mad said:

Nope. They need to get a copy but you still haven't said if the company gave his name and address or if the only PCN letter was addressed to the keeper company?

He could email UKPC with the VRM and name of his company and the location of alleged contravention, pretending he wants to review the images with a view to considering paying the PCN or naming the driver...but saying the company has mislaid the PCN front page and could they kindly supply a copy or at least the PCN number so he can look at the photos and make an informed decision.

Obviously I am NOT saying he should pay or name the driver!  But use the words above, not just "I've lost the PCN".

My suggestion has worked before and is a way to get UKPC to cough up the PCN number in the hope of duping a victim into paying:

appealmoreinfo@ukparkingcontrol.com

Sorry I don’t understand, what company and who’s name and address?
The parking company at this stage only have a vehicle registration number. 

anyhelpwilldo

 Surely the words on the signage “may be “ are not a contractual term as it offers no clarity. 

patient_dream

UKPC have been banging on for years about "driver left site"

They probably think you are mug.  They must prove their claim which would mean they are a predator. They are employed to manage a car park ... they don't actially do that, they farm it for money. 

I cannot recall any court allowing such a claim from UKPC with this wheeze