Possibly mis-sold spray foam insulation

Laurel10

Hi, last year I had spray foam insulation put in my loft. I was told it would increase the property value and reduce my energy bills and be good for the environment. As I am planning on selling my house in the next few years, I went ahead with it believing it to be the right thing to do.

I have recently found out that this type of insulation devalues the property value and has the potential to damage the roof. I feel like a complete idiot and am really worried about it now. 

Should I leave the insulation as it is and worry about the problem when I go to sell the house, or should I have it removed now? If so, how much can I expect to pay? It is open cell insulation. 

Is there any point in pursuing a complaint against the company who sold it to me? My feeling is that there's no point. I signed the paperwork and it's only in retrospect I realise I should have done some research and not fallen for the sales pitch. 

Any thoughts or advice would be welcome. 

FreeBear

Raise the problem with your local CAB and get them to refer it to Trading Standards - There have been a couple of court cases recently.. https://www.herefordshire.gov.uk/news/article/876/salesman-receives-suspended-prison-sentence-for-unfair-trading

Cost of removal will be something in the order of £6-10K depending on how much work is involved. If all the tiles need replacing, that could well double the cost. Your chances of getting the installation cowboys company to pay for remediation is next to zero. If you were successful in suing  them, they'd probably go bankrupt before you had chance to get your money. If you have legal protection, would be worth giving your insurer a call.

Grenage

Assuming the roof had sarking, couldn't that be cut away to remove it from between the rafters?

FreeBear

Grenage said: Assuming the roof had sarking, couldn't that be cut away to remove it from between the rafters?

If there is sarking boards up there, that would make life a lot easier. But it would be difficult to get right in to the eaves where the roof meets the walls. In the absence of sarking, felt (if in good condition) would also provide protection for the tiles, but it would get trashed when the foam is cut out. No felt or sarking would be the worst case scenario.

Bendy_House

Aren't some roof styles 'ok' having this spray-on foam? Or is it always 'bad' news?

Grenage

If no water gets under the tiles then in theory it would be fine.

Very off-putting for many buyers; I've walked away from a house with such as a reason.

Laurel10

I have all the paperwork to say its certified by BBA, the Carbon Trust and various others plus a brochure explaining the type of insulation "breathes' so condensation shouldn't be a problem. I am just not sure whether to believe any of it. 

sevenhills

Lapolla - Foam-Lok FL 3C Lapolla FL 3C spray foam is a superior insulation product that is sprayed in place and fully adheres to the substrate, forming a cellular plastic that will last the life of the structure.

https://energysavingtrust.org.uk/products/lapolla-foam-lok-fl-3c-internal-wall-insulation-ewi/

FreeBear

Bendy_House said: Aren't some roof styles 'ok' having this spray-on foam? Or is it always 'bad' news?

Maybe on a flat roof where the underside is heated. But sprayed in an unheated loft, always bad news.

Laurel10 said: I have all the paperwork to say its certified by BBA, the Carbon Trust and various others plus a brochure explaining the type of insulation "breathes' so condensation shouldn't be a problem. I am just not sure whether to believe any of it. 

Unfortunately, the BBA (and others) will issue certificates to anyone that pays their fees. As for the claim that the open cell foam is breathable is very much debatable. It will contain a percentage of closed cell foam and also have a hard, impermeable skin on the outside - Both will negate any claimed breathable properties.. Having just read the BBA certification, they don't test for water retention nor long term affects on timbers.. On the Icynene web site, I find this document - http://www.uksprayfoam.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/BBA-Product-Sheet-1-Roofs.pdf - Worth a read..

4.2 The product can be installed:
• between, or between and under, timber rafters in a habitable warm pitched roof (room in the roof). Insulation at
rafter level only, with or without counter battens
• between, or between and under, timber rafters in a non-habitable warm pitched roof (loft space). Insulation at rafter
level only, with or without counter battens

• between, or between and over, timber ceiling joists in a ventilated non-habitable cold pitched roof (loft space).
Insulation at ceiling level only

Note the last point. In an unheated (cold) loft space, the foam should be applied between the ceiling joists, not between the rafters. So if the installers have ignored this advice, any warranties are going to be worthless, and you have grounds to have them pay to have the (worthless) "insulation" removed.

MPeterson05

Interesting thread. My elderly parents who have Icynene spray foam insulation were recently doorstepped by a building services firm offering to remove the foam. They  were a offered a 'free' assessment of whether the foam should be removed (and you can probably guess result of their assessment - it obviously needed to be removed!). 

The salesman became very threatening and abusive when they declined his offer. I really find these people the absolute worst of the worst who go around with such tactics and prey on vulnerable pensioners in this way.

I have a feeling that the company who originally sold the Icynene foam insultation to my parents are on and the same people who are now offering the removal service. Doing a bit of digging into this world of dodgy insulation/building services companies, a lot of it all seems to stem from a number of companies/individuals in the Bournemouth/Poole area.

Are we allowed to name and shame on this forum? I have a feeling a lot more of these predatory sales tactics are going on in the UK at the moment.

FreeBear

MPeterson05 said: Are we allowed to name and shame on this forum? I have a feeling a lot more of these predatory sales tactics are going on in the UK at the moment.

You need to be very careful naming & shaming - Name the wrong people, and it would be libel. But if you have links to court cases supporting your claims, then the information is already in the public domain.