Buying a property that’s occupied with tenants

MaryNB

steve866 said:

lookstraightahead said:

steve866 said:

I find it interesting that on this thread and others on here, everyone assumes that all tenants reactions to being asked to move out will be met with refusal and it dragging out for a long time. Is this really the case in general? In my circle of friends none of us would have stayed for months on end if a landlord wanted to sell, we would all have moved out in a reasonable timeframe, is this unique?

I think it's that if you complete and tenants don't move out, you become their landlord. Most lenders will only lend with vacant possession, and because that can never be guaranteed when a property is 'sold' then everyone gets twitchy.

lots of tenants can't just move out and they are legally protected.

I don’t think the OP or anyone was suggesting they should proceed with the purchase with tenants in situ, but everyone is telling the OP to forget about the house because the tenant won’t leave. My experience is that the vast majority of tenants will move out in a reasonable timeframe if asked to leave, but this is of course anecdotal. I’m wondering what the facts are? I assume it will depend on area and value or house etc. 

The tenants want to find somewhere to buy which mean they probably won't want to move into another rental and sign up for a 6 month AST, or pay higher rates for short term rental.

How long it takes will depend on if they have started actively looking or on how fussy they are. OP knows at least they're not looking for a council house so less likely they have to stay until eviction. Given it takes about 3 months for a house purchase to go through I'd use that as a starting point, assuming they are actively looking and are on the cusp of offering that is.

macman

Your conveyancer will not allow you to exchange without vacant possession, unless you are purchasing a BTL. 
I'm not clear if the LL has actually served an S21, having accepted your offer? If not, you are looking at anything from 3 months to 18m to gain possession. If he wants a quick sale, he'll have to buy off the tenants.

macman

steve866 said:

I find it interesting that on this thread and others on here, everyone assumes that all tenants reactions to being asked to move out will be met with refusal and it dragging out for a long time. Is this really the case in general? In my circle of friends none of us would have stayed for months on end if a landlord wanted to sell, we would all have moved out in a reasonable timeframe, is this unique?

It would totally depend on how easily the tenants can find suitable alternative accomodation. The tenant is entitled to stay as long as the tenancy laws allow if they wish to: a LL cannot evict, only a court can.

[Deleted User]

macman said:

steve866 said:

I find it interesting that on this thread and others on here, everyone assumes that all tenants reactions to being asked to move out will be met with refusal and it dragging out for a long time. Is this really the case in general? In my circle of friends none of us would have stayed for months on end if a landlord wanted to sell, we would all have moved out in a reasonable timeframe, is this unique?

It would totally depend on how easily the tenants can find suitable alternative accomodation. The tenant is entitled to stay as long as the tenancy laws allow if they wish to: a LL cannot evict, only a court can.

I’ve seen a few people say this and I’m intrigued as to why that is as surely they have a contract which states that the landlord can supply them with an eviction notice based on an agreed duration? 

I’ve rented a few times in the past and my contract has always stated the landlord can evict me with XYZ notice and no reason.

Tiglet2

Read Post 4 of this:  
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/5180214/tenancies-in-eng-wales-guides-for-landlords-and-tenants/p1

macman

Deleted User said:

macman said:

steve866 said:

I find it interesting that on this thread and others on here, everyone assumes that all tenants reactions to being asked to move out will be met with refusal and it dragging out for a long time. Is this really the case in general? In my circle of friends none of us would have stayed for months on end if a landlord wanted to sell, we would all have moved out in a reasonable timeframe, is this unique?

It would totally depend on how easily the tenants can find suitable alternative accomodation. The tenant is entitled to stay as long as the tenancy laws allow if they wish to: a LL cannot evict, only a court can.

I’ve seen a few people say this and I’m intrigued as to why that is as surely they have a contract which states that the landlord can supply them with an eviction notice based on an agreed duration? 

I’ve rented a few times in the past and my contract has always stated the landlord can evict me with XYZ notice and no reason.

Such a contract is unenforceable. It's also absurd, as an LL cannot 'evict' anyone, or issue an 'eviction notice' The LL can serve notice (S21)  as specified by contract and statute, and then apply for a possession order if the tenant does not vacate. It's up to the court whether to grant a possession order, and given the current backlog, that means possession probably sometime into Autumn 2022.
LL's who write their own TA's will usually find that they are in breach of multiple requirements which make the tenancy unregularised, and until that is remedied, the S21 will be invalid anyway.
To put it briefly, statute law trumps contract law.

BikingBud

EndlessStruggle said:

Luckily my solicitor is no sale, no fee and they have said they will do the majority of the chargeable work last and I'm holding off on a survey until I get some assurance they are planning to move out so it is just time being wasted at the moment.

I knew the house was under priced by about 25k, I guess to take into account it is tenanted so I am waiting for them to come back asking for more money. 

I'm assuming they could afford the rent but not to purchase the house which is why they didn't offer to buy. I don't know much about them other than they weren't happy at the viewing, which I totally understand being a long term renter myself.

The house next door although a bit bigger isn't as nice. I would consider it if it was a bit less, maybe if the price drops. 

There has been some quite significant changes to the other property, it is a corner plot with more land and the house is a bit bigger but not much. Same layout but looks a bit bigger. They have also knocked down the garage, added more windows and done quite a lot more upgrading. 

Offer for next door what you were prepared to pay for this house, what do you have to lose?

lookstraightahead

Deleted User said:

macman said:

steve866 said:

I find it interesting that on this thread and others on here, everyone assumes that all tenants reactions to being asked to move out will be met with refusal and it dragging out for a long time. Is this really the case in general? In my circle of friends none of us would have stayed for months on end if a landlord wanted to sell, we would all have moved out in a reasonable timeframe, is this unique?

It would totally depend on how easily the tenants can find suitable alternative accomodation. The tenant is entitled to stay as long as the tenancy laws allow if they wish to: a LL cannot evict, only a court can.

I’ve seen a few people say this and I’m intrigued as to why that is as surely they have a contract which states that the landlord can supply them with an eviction notice based on an agreed duration? 

I’ve rented a few times in the past and my contract has always stated the landlord can evict me with XYZ notice and no reason.

No. It can take years, and landlords cannot evict. You're placing far too much hope in your seller. Seriously they can't just tell them when to go.

MaryNB

Deleted User said:

macman said:

steve866 said:

I find it interesting that on this thread and others on here, everyone assumes that all tenants reactions to being asked to move out will be met with refusal and it dragging out for a long time. Is this really the case in general? In my circle of friends none of us would have stayed for months on end if a landlord wanted to sell, we would all have moved out in a reasonable timeframe, is this unique?

It would totally depend on how easily the tenants can find suitable alternative accomodation. The tenant is entitled to stay as long as the tenancy laws allow if they wish to: a LL cannot evict, only a court can.

I’ve seen a few people say this and I’m intrigued as to why that is as surely they have a contract which states that the landlord can supply them with an eviction notice based on an agreed duration? 

I’ve rented a few times in the past and my contract has always stated the landlord can evict me with XYZ notice and no reason.

Were you a lodger? If not you've had some dodgy landlords. I've never had that in a tenancy agreement and it's not remotely enforceable. Landlords have no authority to evict without a court order. ETA: A tenant's right to reside at the property only ends if the tenant gives notice or the court issues an eviction order. The expiry of an S21 has no impact on a tenants rights, it's just a landlord saying they want the house back and if they don't get it back by this date they can apply to the court for an eviction order.

74jax

badger09 said:

74jax said:

EndlessStruggle said:

Okay so the tenants are now the least of my problems as the house next door which is almost identical (a few modifications and extra land) is up for sale for 70k more than my accepted offer

Is the house exactly the same?  Same layout, decorated the same (tenanted is usually basic), same size, does it have sitting tenants, etc etc.  Can you provide links to both? 

If you want to wait till next year (time for them to look, view, offer etc) go ahead. If not pull out. Don't spend any money at all until the tenants have started to pay money for searches. 

Why didn't they offer on the house they are renting? 

Why do you think tenants are buying the house next door?

I don't? I don't think they have found anywhere yet.