Pension has finally landed - As an insistent client acting against advice -*DOORS CLOSED 03/09/2021*

Dale72

xylophone said:

No - they are factual.

I fear that the reality is that you (and Diplodicus) have a beef with the simple fact that the adviser dealing with a pension transfer is not obliged (when giving his advice and recommendation) to take into consideration that a client may find it difficult to find a scheme to accept a transfer against advice.

No beef with me, I've managed to transfer mine and am glad I did, and I think Diplodicus is the same. The beef if there is one is that other people are being denied the right to improve their financial future because of the current situation. A situation that has arisen as a direct result of poor (whether as a result of incompetence or malfeasance) advice by an IFA.

xylophone

and offer DeadlyD a practical alternative: forming a ltd company before taking advice or "hoodwinking" Aviva by piling in the proceeds of a DB pension on the back of a £20 account.  

I would not dream of making any such offers.

All I (or other posters) can do is draw the attention of those who enquire about DB transfers to the sites which offer information ( example  https://www.pruadviser.co.uk/knowledge-literature/knowledge-library/transfer-pension-scheme/)

while drawing attention to the fact that notwithstanding the paragraph

A stakeholder pension scheme is currently the only type of scheme which must accept any transfer from another registered pension scheme.

stakeholder pension providers are (apparently)  resisting.

Diplodicus

In the main, without a recommendation to transfer, clients currently are unable to transfer.

Do you agree with that, xylophone? 

Prism

Dale72 said:

xylophone said:

No - they are factual.

I fear that the reality is that you (and Diplodicus) have a beef with the simple fact that the adviser dealing with a pension transfer is not obliged (when giving his advice and recommendation) to take into consideration that a client may find it difficult to find a scheme to accept a transfer against advice.

No beef with me, I've managed to transfer mine and am glad I did, and I think Diplodicus is the same. The beef if there is one is that other people are being denied the right to improve their financial future because of the current situation. A situation that has arisen as a direct result of poor (whether as a result of incompetence or malfeasance) advice by an IFA.

This could have been a poor decision on your part and staying in the DB pension may have been the best thing to do. The problem is that nobody knows until 20+ years down the line.

Dale72

Prism said:

.

This could have been a poor decision on your part and staying in the DB pension may have been the best thing to do. The problem is that nobody knows until 20+ years down the line.

I'm pretty sure it won't take 20+ years in my case to show it was a good decision by the way, but if that is true then how can an IFA say categorically that a transfer would be a bad one without that foresight.

DeadlyD

Diplodicus said:

In the main, without a recommendation to transfer, clients currently are unable to transfer.

Do you agree with that, xylophone? 

That appears to be the case and back to my original point unless I can obtain the recommendation and an IFA won’t give me a guarantee of that prior to spending £6k. It’s just wrong. 

Question do I absolutely need an IFA to agree for the transfer as an insistent client into the Stakeholder? 

Linton

DeadlyD said:

Diplodicus said:

In the main, without a recommendation to transfer, clients currently are unable to transfer.

Do you agree with that, xylophone? 

That appears to be the case and back to my original point unless I can obtain the recommendation and an IFA won’t give me a guarantee of that prior to spending £6k. It’s just wrong. 

Question do I absolutely need an IFA to agree for the transfer as an insistent client into the Stakeholder? 

To come up with a formal recommendation would involve significant work.  Why would the IFA do the work if there was a good chance that you would not pay him?  What is possible is that an IFA could give you a much cheaper initial view that either a transfer would not be recommended or that a transfer may be recommended if additional work was done.  Obviously there cant be any guarantees but it does prevent you spending excessive money on what is clearly seen as a waste of time.

The problem with all these hypothetical questions on whether and under what circumstances a stakeholder pension provider would accept a transfer-in against an IFA's advice is that no-one knows for absolute certainty because as far as we know no-one has tried doing it.  From what Dunstonh has said and what has happened with SIPPs it would seem very likely that the stakeholder pension provider would not accept a transfer-in without an IFA taking on the liability for any future mis-selling claim.  And no sane IFA would agree to that if his insurer would not be prepared to accept the risk.

Linton

Dale72 said:

Prism said:

.

This could have been a poor decision on your part and staying in the DB pension may have been the best thing to do. The problem is that nobody knows until 20+ years down the line.

I'm pretty sure it won't take 20+ years in my case to show it was a good decision by the way, but if that is true then how can an IFA say categorically that a transfer would be a bad one without that foresight.

The IFA could not say that the transfer would end up badly.  After all you could spend all your pension money on lottery tickets and win the jackpot.  He certainly could show that there is a high risk that a transfer would be a a bad decision compared with keeping the guaranteed DB pension.

Daniel54

Linton got there before me, but there is a triage option ( set out in xylophone's Pruadvisor  links but currently down  for the weekend apparently) to set out your case with an IFA and receive a view if the recommendation would be a definite no or not.

To put your case forward you would in any event need to provide many more details than you have felt able to share here.

But in that instance  you won't need to pay for full advice if the initial guidance is clearly negative.

If you wish  to be an insistent client, then from the inputs on this board there are quite clearly no guarantees how you might achieve a non advised transfer.

Taking what is arguably s safe withdrawal rate of 4%,your transferred pot ( after the PCLS) would indicate an income of £4,500 per annum.Is this what you are planning to live off ?

DeadlyD

Daniel54 said:

Linton got there before me, but there is a triage option ( set out in xylophone's Pruadvisor  links but currently down  for the weekend apparently) to set out your case with an IFA and receive a view if the recommendation would be a definite no or not.

To put your case forward you would in any event need to provide many more details than you have felt able to share here.

But in that instance  you won't need to pay for full advice if the initial guidance is clearly negative.

If you wish  to be an insistent client, then from the inputs on this board there are quite clearly no guarantees how you might achieve a non advised transfer.

Taking what is arguably s safe withdrawal rate of 4%,your transferred pot ( after the PCLS) would indicate an income of £4,500 per annum.Is this what you are planning to live off ?

Thank you I will look through the pru link thanks @xylophone. 

I don’t plan to live of the £4500 pa as it wouldn’t provide enough that’s why I gave private and workplace pensions as well as other investments. I’m not sure what’s going to help providing me a positive case apart from inheritance reasons. Clearly I can’t be honest with an IFA that I want to have freedom of choice to retire early pay off mortgage and change my lifestyle which I’ve worked FT all my life for.