Care Home Costs

Brie

I thought that someone's debts died with them but that's in the sense of a credit card or similar.  It sounds like there's an unpaid bill that wasn't dealt with while she was alive and the care home is asking for it to be paid from her estate.  If there is nothing of value that can be sold then there is no estate.  As the house (and contents) were jointly owned they wouldn't be part of the estate.

It is possible that somehow a lien was put on the house but whether that can be actioned now may be dependent on the age of the OP.

Keep_pedalling

Bobbydue said:

Please for the purpose of the question assume she had no assets.

Would other family members be liable?

No, but would you care to explain how someone with substantial income had no savings whatsoever?

Pollycat

Bobbydue said:

Please for the purpose of the question assume she had no assets.

Would other family members be liable?

If you're asking posters to assume something that they have already expressed doubt about, how do you expect to get an accurate answer?

maman

Pollycat said:

Bobbydue said:

Please for the purpose of the question assume she had no assets.

Would other family members be liable?

If you're asking posters to assume something that they have already expressed doubt about, how do you expect to get an accurate answer?

There are instances /threads where sadly people die with absolutely  nothing  but debt in a rented property and living on benefits and posters, who are relatives, ask if they are liable for outstanding bills. In those cases, it's perfectly permissable to take no responsibility.

But @Bobbydue, nothing you've posted suggests that your mother was in a similar position. Either she had assets or she didn't but it's hard to make the assumption that someone who had self funded care from income had no assets at all.

 It would be an amazing mathematical feat to find that all assets, when realised, magically had come to the exact amount paid to the care home to date with absolutely nothing left to pay the outstanding bills.

Of course, you may want to dispute the care home request for additional costs but that's a different question. 

Keep_pedalling

maman said:

Pollycat said:

Bobbydue said:

Please for the purpose of the question assume she had no assets.

Would other family members be liable?

If you're asking posters to assume something that they have already expressed doubt about, how do you expect to get an accurate answer?

There are instances /threads where sadly people die with absolutely  nothing  but debt in a rented property and living on benefits and posters, who are relatives, ask if they are liable for outstanding bills. In those cases, it's perfectly permissable to take no responsibility.

But @Bobbydue, nothing you've posted suggests that your mother was in a similar position. Either she had assets or she didn't but it's hard to make the assumption that someone who had self funded care from income had no assets at all.

 It would be an amazing mathematical feat to find that all assets, when realised, magically had come to the exact amount paid to the care home to date with absolutely nothing left to pay the outstanding bills.

Of course, you may want to dispute the care home request for additional costs but that's a different question. 

And this is what the estate’s creditors will be thinking as well. 

Bobbydue

maman said:

Pollycat said:

Bobbydue said:

Please for the purpose of the question assume she had no assets.

Would other family members be liable?

If you're asking posters to assume something that they have already expressed doubt about, how do you expect to get an accurate answer?

There are instances /threads where sadly people die with absolutely  nothing  but debt in a rented property and living on benefits and posters, who are relatives, ask if they are liable for outstanding bills. In those cases, it's perfectly permissable to take no responsibility.

But @Bobbydue, nothing you've posted suggests that your mother was in a similar position. Either she had assets or she didn't but it's hard to make the assumption that someone who had self funded care from income had no assets at all.

 It would be an amazing mathematical feat to find that all assets, when realised, magically had come to the exact amount paid to the care home to date with absolutely nothing left to pay the outstanding bills.

Of course, you may want to dispute the care home request for additional costs but that's a different question. 

1, Pension paid care home costs
2, Pension ended on death!
3, Zero assets.
4, The end

question who is liable under these circumstances if Zero assets?

simples
 

maman

Bobbydue said:

1, Pension paid care home costs
2, Pension ended on death!
3, Zero assets.
4, The end

question who is liable under these circumstances if Zero assets?

simples
 

If you can successfully present that the estate had no funds as a balance sheet to any creditors of the estate then you can avoid paying the outstanding bills. It seems from what you said, while not insolvent, the estate had somehow achieved zero assets. 

Posters have been raising is the sort of questions you could be asked. 

p00hsticks

Brie said:

I thought that someone's debts died with them but that's in the sense of a credit card or similar.

No that's not right. If a deceased person leaves any assets - money in bank accounts etc - then these should be used to pay off any outstanding debts - credit card bills etc. Ther is a pecking order for how the debt should be paid off, starting with the funeral costs.

I suspect what you are thinking of is when there is not enough in the estate to pay out what is owed. In that case, there is no obligation on relatives etc to pay those debts and they just have to be written off. 

Keep_pedalling

Bobbydue said:

maman said:

Pollycat said:

Bobbydue said:

Please for the purpose of the question assume she had no assets.

Would other family members be liable?

If you're asking posters to assume something that they have already expressed doubt about, how do you expect to get an accurate answer?

There are instances /threads where sadly people die with absolutely  nothing  but debt in a rented property and living on benefits and posters, who are relatives, ask if they are liable for outstanding bills. In those cases, it's perfectly permissable to take no responsibility.

But @Bobbydue, nothing you've posted suggests that your mother was in a similar position. Either she had assets or she didn't but it's hard to make the assumption that someone who had self funded care from income had no assets at all.

 It would be an amazing mathematical feat to find that all assets, when realised, magically had come to the exact amount paid to the care home to date with absolutely nothing left to pay the outstanding bills.

Of course, you may want to dispute the care home request for additional costs but that's a different question. 

1, Pension paid care home costs
2, Pension ended on death!
3, Zero assets.
4, The end

question who is liable under these circumstances if Zero assets?

simples
 

Sorry, you are asking us to believe someone was receiving thousands of pounds a month, and they spent every penny of that income in the years before they went into care and it is just not a believable situation.

if you want your questions answered you need to explain how she ended up with nothing but a jointly owned house.

Megandlg

As your mother had a pension only, it may be that she should have been eligible for some local authority funding of her care home fees. I wonder why she was paying her own fees in full, if this did not leave her any excess money for her own personal needs? 

As you’ve not said what the ‘costs’ that you have been billed for are, it is impossible for anyone to answer the question. I assume these might be for any addition time that her room was unable to be used by the home due to it still having her belongings in it. In this case, the initial contract will cover the home’s stance on this, which is likely to involve family paying fees until the room is cleared. If you do not do so, depending on the size of the care home company, they may choose to sue you for any costs outstanding.