BATA - LPG & possible blackmail!

akwexavante

Just moved into a house that is heated by LPG, this is new to me.  Before i bought (March through to April 2021) i contacted BATA with questions in general about LPG and asked about pricing etc.

They said the current price is 36.9ppl (37ppl to me) and a standing charge of £75 a year.  They offered a regular top up service at the same price if i set up a direct debit for £50 month.....Yikes that's a lot, well it is to me.  My natural gas and electric direct debit has only been £37 month at most and i received a £121 refund when i moved (1st June 2021).

Having now moved in and now starting to sort stuff out, sorting the LPG heating is next on the list.  I contacted BATA and i received an info pack along with a contract to sign.

Oh my god they have moved the goal posts some what............

Am i being bribed and are they scaremongering!?

I have been offered:

Under Contract  42.9ppl +VAT (45.04ppl)

Without contract 49.9ppl + VAT (52.39ppl)

Standing charge £63 year paid quarterly inc VAT.

To qualify for their regular top up service, they want a minimum of £80 a month by direct debit, bloody hell (to be polite) !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

That's more than double what i was paying a month for natural gas & electric over a lockdown winter, and i got a refund.  I would consider paying £35 a month to get started being that LPG is new to me and i am expecting my heating bill to be a little higher than when i used natural gas but there again i am installing a multi fuel stove before the winter starts.

I did try to explain that i would probably be a low user of LPG, was this a mistake?

Are they charging low consumers more than those that use a lot more LPG?

Seriously thinking of switching, but should i lie and tell a new supplier that i'm expecting my consumption to be high to get a lower price?

Reed_Richards

I don't think "blackmail" is quite the right word, "extortion" maybe?  Be that as it may, LPG costs approximately twice as much as natural gas in terms of pence per kWh.  Your new usage may also depend on how well insulated your new house is by comparison with the old one.  

QrizB

Welcome to the joys of house ownership!.

Was your previous property a similar size to your new house? £37/month sounds quite low unless it was eg. a small flat.

As R_R says, LPG is inevitably more expensive than mains gas. A litre of LPG contains about 7kWh of energy so your quoted price of 45ppl is 6.5p per kWh, compared to mains gas which is currently a little over 3p per kWh. If you use 12000kWh/yr of LPG for heating (typical for a medium-sized household) that will be £780/yr, an average of £65/month. Plus the standing charge.

Obviously your electricity will be on top of this. The same medium household uses 2900kWh/yr which, at 16p/kWh, is £464/yr, £38/month. Plus standing charge.

akwexavante

Thank you.  The house is a smaller end-terraced two bedroomed house and is not well insulated in the loft. It has retro fitted cavity wall insulation though.  It will be well insulated before the winter sets in and have a multi fuel stove fitted.

I don't normally put the heating on in a normal year until Late November'ish, and it goes off by the end of March normally.  If it's cold, put on a woolly or two before the heating goes on.  Well, at least get dressed properly rather than wander about the house in shorts and t shirt!

My previous house was a slightly larger mid-terrace two bedroomed house with a solid wall.

Been making a few phone calls.... New potential problem that may require overcoming.  Given what i'm being told, i am now aware that the above ground 1200ltr tank may have to be moved, well turned 90 degrees would do it.  At the mo it's only 2.9mtrs away from a concrete garage and only 1.4mtrs away from the face / vertical side of a hawthorn hedge (Boundary hedge with neighbour's house which is about 5mtrs away from the tank.

Thank you QrizB for that info.  Somewhere i have written down how many kwh's of gas i used over the last few years, i'll be able to work things out a little more accurately with that.   There's a pub within 300yrds..... might be cheaper to sit in the pub watching TV with a pint in hand than stay at home!!!!!!!  £780yr will buy an awful lot of Guinness November to March every winter.

I'm now exploring if i can move (Turn) this 1200ltr tank myself, or whether i have to get a pro to do it and do it before i switch supplier.

lohr500

I don't know much about LPG tanks and someone may come along who knows a lot more. Sorry to be a killjoy, but are you sure it is your tank and not supplied by BATA? The fact that you have a standing charge makes me think they may have provided the tank to the previous homeowner. If so, you might not be able to switch supplier just like that. Also, I have no idea on the regs. for moving tanks. It is the sort of job I would be perfectly happy tackling myself, but again, it may not be your tank to move    Was the tank covered by the conveyancing process when you moved house (assuming you purchased it)?

J_B

Maybe you need to read this pinned thread

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/1003291/bulk-lpg-cheapest-suppliers-supply-route

but, perhaps not all 364 pages

The industry is run by a bunch of sharks (allegedly!) - get used to it!

Mister_G

lohr500 said:

I don't know much about LPG tanks and someone may come along who knows a lot more. Sorry to be a killjoy, but are you sure it is your tank and not supplied by BATA? The fact that you have a standing charge makes me think they may have provided the tank to the previous homeowner. If so, you might not be able to switch supplier just like that. Also, I have no idea on the regs. for moving tanks. It is the sort of job I would be perfectly happy tackling myself, but again, it may not be your tank to move    Was the tank covered by the conveyancing process when you moved house (assuming you purchased it)?

As someone who knows quite a bit more (38 years of LPG), let me explain the likely situation.  It is highly likely that the tank currently belongs to BATA, as not many people own their own tanks.  However, changes to the regulations a few years ago now mean that a contract with a supplier can only last two years and then you are free to move.  The new supplier will arrange to takeover the tank.

In the case of the OP, they have no contract at present (the old one expired on the change of ownership of the house) and are free to chose a supplier. I would certainly suggest shopping around as 30-35ppl is quite achievable at present.

lohr500

Thanks for the clarification Mister_G. 

akwexavante

Thank you to those that posted over the weekend.  As Mister_G says, this is the situation i'm in.  I own the house and moved in.  The tank is owned by BATA.  What BATA have offered me as contract to a novice and newcomer to all things LPG is extortionate.

They are hoping that i will sign and agree to their contract and high prices.  I'm also assuming that they know that moving to a new supplier will be difficult if not impossible because the tank's current position does not meet current building regulations and i'll have to pay a lot of money to have it moved or in my case just turned 90 degrees would do it before another supplier would buy the tank from BATA..  They are assuming that i won't want to have the tank moved (Turned) and or can't or won't pay for it to be moved.  Cheaper to pay the higher prices for fuel than move the tank.  Moving the tank would free me up to switch, and it would comply with current building control regs too which would make me happier should something happen.  An insurance company presumably would refuse to pay out for repairs etc if the tank's position didn't meet building regs, not sure.

BATA are not obliged to move the tank making it legal, and they would be doing so knowing that my plans are to switch too, which of course they don't want me to do.   A new supplier won't adopt the tank as is either.  So you could argue that i'm stuck.   BATA are hoping that i'm too lazy or can't be bothered to do something about it.

Put me in my place and correct me if i'm wrong but i think i have three options to get the tank moved:

1, Pay i high price £750+ to get it moved professionally.

2, Attempt to move it myself with the possible help of an LPG heating engineer.  Get an engineer to safely disconnect it.  Move it a tad to one side somehow. Put down a new base, move the tank onto the new base and get the same engineer to connect it back up again.  This is something i'm exploring this week.  One of the things i need to do is find out what an empty 1200ltr tank weighs and work out a way of moving it. Push!? or lift and put some wheels on / under it.

3, Wait until i empty it, get BATA to take it away which i'm told would be free!!!!!!!!  Then put down a new base and get another supplier to deliver and plumb in a new tank, which i'm also told would be free!!!!!!!!