NCP Pay Later (and my wife forgot....)

andylong1974

Hi,
I have searched the forums, but cannot find a match with a result (this is close NCP Ticketless parking problem. — MoneySavingExpert Forum). My wife parked in an NCP with the new Pay Later option. Being a busy mum, she forgot to pay online when she got home, only remembering about a week later. We didnt contact NCP, mainly because it was impossible to get through to anyone so I gave up which, by reading other threads, is probably a good thing. I have received a PCN today in my name (I am registered owner). Am I banged to rights and need to pay the £60 (rising to £100) or are there other options in these circumstances. I am guessing that not paying at all is more clear cut than overstaying/underpaying. If I do have to pay, would NCP be open to installments as we are skint after a car repair and children's birthdays. 
I have succesfully overturned PCNs on appeal with help from this forum in the past, but this one feels different. 

Fruitcake

Was the parking paid for eventually?

I think you are on a sticky wicket here unless the NTK was not PoFA compliant. You should check it against the strict requirements of the Act before you decide what to do.

Bilking (not paying for parking) is one of the reasons these unregulated parking companies exist, and it is hard to defend unless there was a legitimate reason not to pay, such as payment machines out of order, or the signage was not capable of forming a contract with the motorist.
Even then, the former would have been unacceptable reason because of the pay later option.an 

Coupon-mad

Depends if the NTK in the post is a POFA one or not and all this is already explained in the NEWBIES thread.

andylong1974

Sorry, I am little confused. I have the NTK (my wife was driving, I am the keeper) and it says I am invited to pay or identify the driver. If I do neither and use the template in the newbies thread (below) is that the correct first appeal considering this isn't an overstay, but a total non-payment. 

Re PCN number:

I dispute your 'parking charge', as the keeper of the vehicle. I deny any liability or contractual agreement and I will be making a complaint about your predatory conduct to your client landowner.

There will be no admissions as to who was driving and no assumptions can be drawn. Since your PCN is a vague template, I require an explanation of the allegation and your evidence. You must include a close up actual photograph of the sign you contend was at the location on the material date as well as your images of the vehicle.

If the allegation concerns a PDT machine, the data supplied in response to this appeal must include the record of payments made - showing partial VRNs - and an explanation of the reason for the PCN, because your Notice does not explain it.

If the allegation involves an alleged overstay of minutes, your evidence must include the actual grace period agreed by the landowner.

Umkomaas

If you want to challenge it, just use the template you've copied and pasted above. That will at least get you a POPLA code where you can try your luck there.  If that is also refused, you can take your chance on whether NCP will pursue via a county court claim - they may or may not do, but remember that it costs them more to pursue a single ticket than they are likely to be able to recover, but they do have 6 years in which to do so, and common sense/logic sometimes goes out of the window. We can't give guarantees. 

You only owe them something if a Judge tells you that you do. 

Is their NtK compliant with the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (Schedule 4)?  If you're unsure, upload a copy here, redacted of all your personal data and the car's VRM, but leave all dates showing. Both sides please. 

Fruitcake

The appeal template in blue text that you will find in the NEWBIES is the correct one to use. Send it unaltered, from the keeper.

Was payment for parking eventually made, or at least an attempt made to pay?

Is the NTK PoFA compliant? 

andylong1974

Many thanks for the reply. Here is the NTK as requested

andylong1974

Fruitcake said:

The appeal template in blue text that you will find in the NEWBIES is the correct one to use. Send it unaltered, from the keeper.

Was payment for parking eventually made, or at least an attempt made to pay?

Is the NTK PoFA compliant? 

No, because my wife completely forgot and didnt realise until some time later at which point it was way past the 24 hour period. 

andylong1974

I am curious - does the NTK say the keeper will be liable after 28 days or is it saying I need to name them and then they will be liable. Not sure if that is a subtle difference. 

Castle

Based on date of sending of 9th June, it's deemed to have arrived two working days later; so on 11th June.

Unfortunately for NCP this is one day too late in order to comply with the 14 day deadline imposed by POFA; based on the incident date of 27th May.

andylong1974

Castle said:

Based on date of sending of 9th June, it's deemed to have arrived two working days later; so on 11th June.

Unfortunately for NCP this is one day too late in order to comply with the 14 day deadline imposed by POFA; based on the incident date of 27th May.

Thank you for pointing this out. Should this be added to my initial appeal or do I leave that till later?