Napier Parking - Claim Form

youngie24

Redx said:

youngie24 said:

Not_A_Hope said:

Any contract they allege you entered into is in the small print on the Private Land sign. Unfortunately I cannot read it.

Most car parks and their trade associations suggest there should be a grace period. Usually 10 minutes. I don't know if you have referred to this is your witness statement especially if you were only there for 3 minutes.

Put them to strict proof the period you were there and ask what grace periods were in place. 

I have not mentioned it in my witness statement as I was not aware of a 10 minute ruling 

The grace periods are defined in the IPC CoP , of the version in force on the day of the incident , so not necessarily a 10 minute rule , not for private parking or private land

The new CoP due next year by the dhulg should finalise grace periods for all

Ok it mentions further down in the post that the ruling foe 10 runs upto 1.11.19
so will be covered by that all being well and will most certainly mention it tomorrow

Not_A_Hope

The images of the signs the claimant has provided are known as stock images of the signs taken in daylight probably on somebodys desk when the signs were new. Point out to the judge that it was dark and the signs were not illuminated.  The photos of the signs on the wall show their actual condition and how difficult the terms and conditions would be to read even in daylight. This is contrary to their statement in Site Evidence para 9 that the T&Csare displayed on large highly prominent signs.

In the claimants para 50 they refer to non-payment additional charges / costs of £60. I repeat again these additional charges are not allowed for PCNs in the Small Claims Court. Make sure the Judge is aware of rulings such as Excel v Wilkinson which may result in the claim being reduced or dismissed altogether as an abuse of process as PPCs and the legal representatives should know better.

youngie24

oh thank you so much … again I will note this and will most certainly mention it to the judge tomorrow …

Not_A_Hope

Finally you still haven't posted the page of the Landowner Contract with the signatories. It needs to have two authorised signatories (owner, director, company secretary) from each party to sign a document for it to be validly executed and meet the requirements if the Companies Act. Often there is only one signatory from each party and the names and positions within the company often redacted which might suggest that they are not authorised to form a contract with another party as required by the Act.

 Jenni D pointed out you can challenge them to prove the contract was still in force after 12 months.

Make a list of all the points you wish to raise with the judge from lack of prominent illuminated signage, grace periods, double recovery (£60), Landowner agreement etc.

Best of luck

youngie24

I did post it earlier .. I will post again .. again I will take note of all the points raised and thank you 🙏 🤞🏻

youngie24

Both directors ? 

Not_A_Hope

One director has signed as Landowner and one director from the parking company. As it needs two signatures from each party that agreement does not comply with section 44 of the Companies Act and could be argued not to be legally executed.

44Execution of documents

(1)Under the law of England and Wales or Northern Ireland a document is executed by a company—

(a)by the affixing of its common seal, or

(b)by signature in accordance with the following provisions.

(2)A document is validly executed by a company if it is signed on behalf of the company—

(a)by two authorised signatories, or

(b)by a director of the company in the presence of a witness who attests the signature.

(3)The following are “authorised signatories” for the purposes of subsection (2)—

(a)every director of the company, and

(b)in the case of a private company with a secretary or a public company, the secretary (or any joint secretary) of the company.

Whether a Judge will take any notice is another matter but you should bring it to his/ her attention

youngie24

Great and thanks again for your time and support 

Not_A_Hope

Youngie 24 you commented above:-

Ok it mentions further down in the post that the ruling foe 10 runs upto 1.11.19
so will be covered by that all being well and will most certainly mention it tomorrow.

Please note RedXs comment that in your case there is no '10 minute rule' but you can argue that for anyone attempting to find and read unclear signage in the dark your three minute stay would not be unreasonable

youngie24

Ok so just to clarify the 10 minute rule doesn’t apply to me ? But I can argue about the unclear signage in the dark and the FACT I was only their for 3 minutes ?