Silicone caulk expired?

MrBrindle

Hi all, had to silicone some wide spaces in my partners conservatory dog grooming 'salon'. I won't go into the details as to what it is, but I had to silicone 0.5-1cm gaps where we installed some wooden beams to support some equipment. I siliconed the gaps on Sunday night and the silicone is still tacky to touch and has barely hardened at all.

It doesn't have an expiry date on the tube, but date of manufacture was in 2018 - yes, It was an old tube I had in the garage!

Is it likely to have gone off, and I need to scrape out and start again??

TIA.

Jeepers_Creepers

Make and type of sili?

I'd have thought that, when it comes to tubes of sili, going 'off' would mean it's hardened in the tube...

If it came out ok, and you managed to apply a bead as normal, it should set - surely?

Is it smelly sili - vinegary? Or water-based?

MrBrindle

I chucked the tube last night! It was a Geocel brand, not sure what specific one. 

I have read that they sometimes do not set or cure at all if expired, this is still tacky to touch and I have just removed a blob of it and it's still the same as if it was coming out of the tube. Also this is in the conservatory, and it's been reasonably warm, so the outer should have definitely 'skinned' over by now.

Checked the Geocel website and it states products expire within one year of manufacture (it was 2018) - bu*ger, fun night ahead!

fenwick458

if I were you I'd still leave it for at least a week and see if it cures. rather than rake it all out and start again. I 've never known silicone not to cure before, generally if it comes out of the tube then it's ok

Jeepers_Creepers

Geocel is good stuff, as far as I know. 
Again - does it have a smell? 
For most sealants and caulks, the issue with being 'out of date' is that it sets or thickens in the tube. But I have to say, what you are experiencing does seem pretty clear cut - it just ain't setting.
As Fen says, if the job is otherwise neat enough, just leave it for a week and keep your fingers crossed. It'll almost certainly be messy to remove...
You can also try emailing Geocel, but they'll want to know what stuff you used (as would we... :-)  )

MrBrindle

Right I've looked up Geocel products and the colours on the tube suggest it was 'frame seal' - which I know was probably wrong for the job anyway, but I had it lying around the garage so figured I may as well use it.

Also smell? No, nothing. 

The only snag with leaving it in place is that my partner has dogs booked in tomorrow and friday for grooming, as well as next week. And after she did a dog Monday I noticed loads of hairs  stuck to the silicon (arghhhh). I wiped it back to a fresh finish after that, but it's been very tacky. If I continue to leave it in place it will gather more dog hairs again and look a mess.

I've done a fair bit of DIY in the past and never had this problem with silicone and caulking. They've always 'skinned' over within 24 hours, and the fact this hasn't, and hasn't even begun to cure at all seems very strange. 

Last summer I used another old tube of nomorenails to repair some upvc stuff outside, and it's still 'sticky' to touch. So I assume these adhesives and silicone can go be bad, even if they do apply as normal.

Jeepers_Creepers

Frame Sealant should be ok in general, but there might be a couple of issues which are slowing this down. One is the size of the gap being filled - half to 1 cm is big, so I guess that's a lot of sealant?

I also suspect - since it ain't smelly (not acetic, but not solventy either) - that it's water-based (acrylic or similar), and this does tend to take longer to dry out as water ain't as volatile as other solvents.

Probably it ain't skinning because the outer surface is being fed more 'water' from its bulk.

Also - possibly - the surfaces it's been applied to might not be very porous? This, too, slows down curing. Mind you, you mentioned timber, so that is, but what's the other surface?

Don't know what to suggest - if it's getting messy, then i guess it needs to come out. At least - if it's water-based - it'll be much easier to clean up.

MrBrindle

Thanks for the help. 

Yeah the gap is quite big and in hindsight probably should've possibly filled with expanding foam a bit first.

The gap is wood to painted plasterboard - satin finish.

Think it will have to come out, and I'll test a patch with some newer sealant to see if that works.

Question is what sort of sealant - it's an absolute minefield! Even though I worked at a builders merch for 5 years I still get confused with all the types.....

Jeepers_Creepers

Yup - it's a 'mare :-)

I'd normally say a good quality decorator's caulk, one that can be smoothed over with a wet finger or spoon, for indoor gap/joint-solving, but that's quite a large gap, tho'... Perhaps build up layers - squeeze the first lot right in and let it almost set, and then apply a finishing bead.

The surfaces you are applying it to - timber and painted p'board - should be ok, and allow drying reasonably well.

Have you tried silicone finishing blades like Fugi? Not sure it works on caulk (tho' can't see why not as long as it's used before it skins), but it's great for getting a neat bead.

Jeepers_Creepers

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BJ_gSKtKVtw

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oq0juhNqGss

Haven't watched these, but they'll likely be helpful

MrBrindle

Thanks again.

The only snag with using decorators caulk is that the room is a conservatory, and I think with all the fluctuating heat and cold, decorators caulk will crack. Also I was hoping to use something with more adhesive properties because I had a mare attaching the wood to the plasterboard - so a bit of extra help from the adhesive would be handy!

Funnily I read up on those foam strips last night, because the gap is not only wide, but deep as well. But can't seem to find them anywhere around here. Tried b&q, local builders and plumbers merchants - nothing! I was even thinking of buying some pipe insulation and cutting that intro strips - assuming it's the same material.

Not tried anyblades, I tend to spray the silicon/caulk with soapy water, then bead with a finger - a trick a builder showed me!