Adding lock to gate that is "half" on neighbour's RWP

carefullycautious

If I was your 'friendly neighbour' I would like a spring loaded gate that could be left unlocked during the day but would close behind me to prevent dog getting out. You could then lock it at night for security.

I would not want to keep unlocking a gate every time I needed to bring bins etc through the shared ROW.

As to the 'unfriendly neighbour' I would just do the job as she does not use this ROW. I would however try to not antagonise her as a dispute is the last thing you need.

joe90mitch

Martin_the_Unjust said:

1. Put a lock on the gate.
2. Give anyone who has right of way and needs to use it a key to the lock.
3. Give anyone who has right of way but doesn’t need to use a key to a different lock
In the unlikely event that they try it and realise it doesn’t work apologise and give them the correct key (then change the lock a couple of days later)

Hahaha sneaky - not a terrible idea. Like I said to twopenny, in all honesty it wouldn't even be the end of the world if she had a key. Just would rather not - the whole point of having it secure is feeling more confident of letting the dog be in the garden, I guess if there's a weak link in the chain who might act spiteful it could take away from that though.

joe90mitch

carefullycautious said:

If I was your 'friendly neighbour' I would like a spring loaded gate that could be left unlocked during the day but would close behind me to prevent dog getting out. You could then lock it at night for security.

I would not want to keep unlocking a gate every time I needed to bring bins etc through the shared ROW.

As to the 'unfriendly neighbour' I would just do the job as she does not use this ROW. I would however try to not antagonise her as a dispute is the last thing you need.

Hi, thanks for replying. Hopefully a case of great minds think alike here I have already got a spring and need to add it to the gate, there's a loose latch on the top of the gate that I'm hoping I can just re-screw (thankfully the loose bit is on the gate, not the neighbour's post) and that should sort that one issue.

Have already run the lock by the neighbour (not even mentioned the spring) and she was really keen for that. Can always go to leaving it unlocked during the day if it becomes a faff.

Seems like more and more people are suggesting just trying to put the lock in and it should be fine, then just adapt/reverse if she complains. This was kind of my thought at the time, I think it may end up being the best approach.

princeofpounds

Yes there will be more specific descriptions of the rights in your title deeds and probably in your neighbours' title deeds too. Unfortunately these will be in a kind of legalese. What you received from your solicitor is a brief description in plain English, which is great for making you aware of it and explaining the basics, but doesn't fully establish your legal position. That's why they subsequently ask you if you have any concerns to discuss. For example, there is a big difference between a right of way for a specific purpose, and a right of way 'at all times and for all purposes'.

If your difficult neighbour complains and you remove the lock (or provide a key if that's satisfactory), no, that is not a dispute.

There's a decent chance your difficult neighbour doesn't even realise she has a ROW into your land.

I did think Martin's suggestion was kind of funny and could be another plan B approach.

Jeepers_Creepers

joe90mitch said:

We recently got a dog and have found that work people/our friendly neighbour (/maybe even this difficult neighbour who could be trying to spite us) have left the gate open numerous times. It can only be closed with a bolt from one side currently. I am going to add a spring to the gate, but I would also like to add a double sided long throw lock to it and give the friendly neighbour a couple of set of keys

Hi Joe 90.

Why isn't just a self-closing spring enough? This should ensure the gate cannot be left open, whilst at the same time allowing unfettered access as required by the RoW. (What does RWP stand for?)

You could even add a sign - 'dawg loose in garden - please don't prop gate open'.

Or, could you add a second gate at the end of your extension to properly secure your garden, where it's beyond the RoW to the non-existent loos, and this one you can lock with impunity and give only the friendly neighb (who needs access to their garden) a key?

joe90mitch

Jeepers_Creepers said:

joe90mitch said:

We recently got a dog and have found that work people/our friendly neighbour (/maybe even this difficult neighbour who could be trying to spite us) have left the gate open numerous times. It can only be closed with a bolt from one side currently. I am going to add a spring to the gate, but I would also like to add a double sided long throw lock to it and give the friendly neighbour a couple of set of keys

Hi Joe 90.

Why isn't just a self-closing spring enough? This should ensure the gate cannot be left open, whilst at the same time allowing unfettered access as required by the RoW. (What does RWP stand for?)

You could even add a sign - 'dawg loose in garden - please don't prop gate open'.

Or, could you add a second gate at the end of your extension to properly secure your garden, where it's beyond the RoW to the non-existent loos, and this one you can lock with impunity and give only the friendly neighb (who needs access to their garden) a key?

Yeah all good ideas. I thought RWP was a common term as it appeared on our deeds (admittedly the historical ones) - I don't even know but I assume it's right of way passageway? But yes, ROW might be more common, apologies.

Yep I'm hoping spring with latch will suffice. I just think it would add to our feeling of security to have a lock but isn't the end of the world. The gate is very apparent at the end of our alleyway and my partner has seen all the news recently about dog thefts so I think that's front of her mind, so it'd be a nice extra to add a lock. But admittedly not the end of the world.

Jeepers_Creepers

I was just thinking in terms of 'what can you do with zero concerns about breaching RoWs?' Adding just a spring should have no come-back - except the gate's (drrrr-cheeesh).

Perhaps start with that, and then leave it a few weeks before adding a lock in agreement with your friendly neighb who has a legit access requirement?

No potential to add that second gate level with the end of your extension? If it's beyond the marked 'loo' RoW, then it's entirely your call to fit this (with a key for the nice neighb, of course). It would also mean that anyone trying to gain illegitimate entry to your garden would have to negotiate two gates.

MalMonroe

I can't believe that your difficult neighbour seems to have taken over to the extent that she appears to be in charge of everything and everybody for miles around. How did that happen? It's as if everyone has to tiptoe around her, bowing and curtseying as they go, for some reason. I wish I could have that kind of authority. Or course it could be that she's deeply unhappy, sounds like it to me. Even more so now you have bonded with your friendly neighbour and she's been even more left out. 

If I were you I wouldn't leave my dog out in the garden alone anyway. Not just because of dog thefts but if a dog of mine escaped and was injured or killed on the road or something because of my own careless I'd never forgive myself. When neighbours have to share, whatever it is, it's always best to try to get along though because otherwise you'll all be utterly miserable. Kudos to you for leaning over backwards to accommodate everyone else. I hope you are also being as kind to yourselves! 

Seems like a spring lock would be the best solution all round. You don't want to antagonise neighbours, even if they are awkward and bossy.

joe90mitch

MalMonroe said:

I can't believe that your difficult neighbour seems to have taken over to the extent that she appears to be in charge of everything and everybody for miles around. How did that happen? It's as if everyone has to tiptoe around her, bowing and curtseying as they go, for some reason. I wish I could have that kind of authority. Or course it could be that she's deeply unhappy, sounds like it to me. Even more so now you have bonded with your friendly neighbour and she's been even more left out. 

If I were you I wouldn't leave my dog out in the garden alone anyway. Not just because of dog thefts but if a dog of mine escaped and was injured or killed on the road or something because of my own careless I'd never forgive myself. When neighbours have to share, whatever it is, it's always best to try to get along though because otherwise you'll all be utterly miserable. Kudos to you for leaning over backwards to accommodate everyone else. I hope you are also being as kind to yourselves! 

Seems like a spring lock would be the best solution all round. You don't want to antagonise neighbours, even if they are awkward and bossy.

Haha my post probably has over egged it. With our neighbour the difficulties have literally only been about this gate and the shared hedge, nothing else so far

And yes we don't leave the dog on her own, the difficulty is even if we open the door and she runs out we can't be sure the garden gate is shut as it's just out of sight around the corner 

sammyjammy

If she is concerned with people wandering about and security could you put a gate on the front of your ginnel?  I live in a terraced house, block of 5 with ROW access for people to get to their houses.  We had a problem years back with opportunistic thieves wandering around at the back of our houses.  We now have a metal fretwork gate with a coded padlock.  Neighbours till have a gate to stop their dog getting into other peoples gardens but its just a normal garden gate.

One of our neighbours wasn't keen as she was worried about access if there were a fire in her house but she got used to it.  As a single householder it really gives me peace of mind.  Anyone trusted can have the code, we've never changed it in those years - although I would like to