Help! Evicting a nightmare lodger!

[Deleted User]

The point about lodgers not being allowed locks on their doors is mentioned here:

https://landlordlawblog.co.uk/2018/03/01/resident-landlord-rights-lodger-tenant/

And

https://m.spareroom.co.uk/content/info-landlords/whats-the-difference-between-a-tenant-and-a-lodger/

Any government website that says otherwise must just have been poorly drafted!

I do think if this woman phones Shelter and describes her situation, they'll probably tell her that she has a tenancy. And that the resident landlord is actually to all intents and purposes living elsewhere.

However practically speaking (and especially if she has friends/connections in the area), you may hopefully find that, given reasonable time to find new accomodation, before long she'll accept it hasn't worked out and move somewhere else. 

Lodgers normally have a notice period of one rental period.  I think a month is fine, but if the cannabis smoking continues and disturbs others then might push for less.  

I'd really be very surprised if it ever made it to court / become a matter for lawyers.

Maybe a financial inducement will help?  For instance she might not have the funds to put down for another place.

General_Grant

My local council's website includes,
"A HMO licence is valid for one property and normally lasts for 5 years. 

"You must get a licence from us if your property:

• has 5 or more unrelated people living in it
• has 2 or more separate households living there"

Obviously there are more instances (like previous licence having expired) but nothing about proximity of other HMO properties.  I really cannot see the sense in using a proximity condition.

The situation described in the OP falls into the requirement for a licence - unless two or more of the occupants are actually related.

theoretica

[Deleted User] said:

Type_45 said:

SpiderLegs said:

Is this property registered as an HMO?

No, and it doesn't need to be. It's been checked.

HMO licenses are only applicable of there are other HMOs within a certain radius of the property in question. 

This mainly occurs in student areas.

But elsewhere, if your HMO isn't near many other HMOs, then no licence is needed.

Suggest this is checked again as there can be very serious financial consequences for operating unregistered HMO. 

I agree.  I fear there may have been confusion between being needing a licence and needing planning permission, perhaps. And there was something changed in England about the number of storeys in the building about 2 or 3 years ago.

wannabe_a_saver

Sounds like your friend is running a HMO, and if he has been spending 6 nights a week at his partner's home for a year it could definitely be argued that they are tenants not lodgers and that the house is not his main residence.  

tasticz

sounds like a HMO also to me and the keeping 1 room and staying once a week and checking in every day is like a thin line to between main residence and HMO... sounds though its going to be messy

Type_45

Yes, I do agree. The 4th lodger room was converted from an office at the end of last year (2020) and has recently been let.

This probably has made the property an HMO requiring a licence. 

I will inform my family member and suggest they call the council asap.

Previously it was only 4 people in the house (landlord and 3 lodgers).

Type_45

tasticz said:

sounds like a HMO also to me and the keeping 1 room and staying once a week and checking in every day is like a thin line to between main residence and HMO... sounds though its going to be messy

It's the landlords main residence. Their vote is registered at that address, they pay all the bills. Covid meant that they bubbled with their partner.

[Deleted User]

Getting on the blower to the council first thing Monday morning might not be the best idea.   A bit of thought is needed first about what the plan is.

The property will surely require a lot of adaptations to qualify for an HMO license.   Fire doors with door closers, hard wired alarm system, emergency corridor lighting in case of power cut, etc.

And living with a rotating, transient cast of characters, each with their own quirks/foibles/drug problems.

Is this really what the LL wants for his home?

wannabe_a_saver

Type_45 said:

tasticz said:

sounds like a HMO also to me and the keeping 1 room and staying once a week and checking in every day is like a thin line to between main residence and HMO... sounds though its going to be messy

It's the landlords main residence. Their vote is registered at that address, they pay all the bills. Covid meant that they bubbled with their partner.

It doesn't matter what paperwork someone keeps at that address to try and make it look as though they live there,  what matters is if they actually live there or not, and it sounds like he doesn't.

Being in a support bubble doesn't mean moving in with that person.  I'm in a support bubble with my mum, thank god it doesn't for both our sakes! 

Type_45

In fairness, there has only been 4 lodgers for the past 3 weeks. Prior to that it's been 3 (plus the landlord). So it hasn't been going on long with 4 lodgers.


But I do agree with the previous post, that the hoops you have to jump through may make limiting yourself to 3 lodgers a more desirable number.