Parcel2Go / Hermes stolen contents

lajedop368

I'll keep this as brief and to the point as I can. 

- I sold a laptop on eBay for £400. The buyepaid, and I packaged it up securely. Entered the weight, dimensions and value accurately on Parcel2Go to get quotes. Went with Hermes next day 

- Dropped off yesterday. It arrived today. Or rather, the empty package did.

- The tracking shows delivered, and the proof of delivery is a photo. On closer inspection you can see where the parcel tape has been cut and resealed. 

- There is no way it was damaged in transit as the charger was in a separate cardboard sleeve with the laptop. The sleeve is still in the box but the charger isn't either! 

- I believe the buyer in this instance

  - I didn't take out additional insurance, but I did accurately declare the contents and value

   I've raised a claim with Parcel2Go which I'm expecting to go nowhere. They'll claim it was delivered and that'll be the end of that. 

The buyer will file a claim (I don't blame him!) and I'll have to refund £400 via PayPal as eBay and PayPal always sides with the buyer.

   Ultimately we've both been shafted. He's got an empty box instead of a laptop and I've sold something which hasn't arrived.  Is it worth going to small claims or do I have no hope? Should I chalk it up to "experience"?  Annoying, but I can see them falling back on the "you didn't pay for parcel protection and we delivered it. Look, heres a photo!"   What would my next steps be? I could argue the toss that he signed for it etc but it feels immortal           

[Deleted User]

So what insurance did you take out? 

lajedop368

MarkN88 said:

So what insurance did you take out? 

None. Although surely that doesn't mean they can deliver an empty box without some kind of comeback.

I almost wish it had just been "lost" as although that would be code for stolen I'd accept it as a he said she said. The fact they delivered an empty box (which the driver apparently commented felt empty) with blatent evidence of theft is worse

custardy

lajedop368 said:

MarkN88 said:

So what insurance did you take out? 

None. Although surely that doesn't mean they can deliver an empty box without some kind of comeback.

I almost wish it had just been "lost" as although that would be code for stolen I'd accept it as a he said she said. The fact they delivered an empty box (which the driver apparently commented felt empty) with blatent evidence of theft is worse

Seems near daily we get someone not buying insurance but questioning why they should still have cover.
now you are in a position where you are likely going to have to go small claims.

Spoonie_Turtle

lajedop368 said:

MarkN88 said:

So what insurance did you take out? 

None. Although surely that doesn't mean they can deliver an empty box without some kind of comeback.

I do see your point.  If it were damaged or lost then it's more a case of, accidents happen and you should have taken out cover in case this happened.  But this is different, this is deliberate and blatant by someone in the delivery process and just because you didn't take out the right insurance shouldn't mean they get to ignore it.  Someone has taken the decision to steal the contents of your parcel - not the whole parcel, just the contents!! - which is not negligence (as damage or loss could be), it's deliberate theft.

blackdog2220

custardy said:

lajedop368 said:

MarkN88 said:

So what insurance did you take out? 

None. Although surely that doesn't mean they can deliver an empty box without some kind of comeback.

I almost wish it had just been "lost" as although that would be code for stolen I'd accept it as a he said she said. The fact they delivered an empty box (which the driver apparently commented felt empty) with blatent evidence of theft is worse

Seems near daily we get someone not buying insurance but questioning why they should still have cover.
now you are in a position where you are likely going to have to go small claims.

what would insurance have covered ? lost in transit , damaged in transit 

it would not have mattered if he had taken £1000 worth or insurance , as it was not lost in transit or damaged  , 

custardy

blackdog2220 said:

custardy said:

lajedop368 said:

MarkN88 said:

So what insurance did you take out? 

None. Although surely that doesn't mean they can deliver an empty box without some kind of comeback.

I almost wish it had just been "lost" as although that would be code for stolen I'd accept it as a he said she said. The fact they delivered an empty box (which the driver apparently commented felt empty) with blatent evidence of theft is worse

Seems near daily we get someone not buying insurance but questioning why they should still have cover.
now you are in a position where you are likely going to have to go small claims.

what would insurance have covered ? lost in transit , damaged in transit 

it would not have mattered if he had taken £1000 worth or insurance , as it was not lost in transit or damaged  , 

If the box is delivered empty then by its very nature it is 'lost' in transit.

RFW

You've possibly been the subject of a theft, so may be worth reporting a crime. It's doubtful that would lead anywhere but if no one knows about it then it certainly won't.
As a buyer it happened to me a while back. An empty parcel (supposed to be a Computer tablet) was received. The company sent out a new one. It was quite a blatant robbery, likely by someone with the courier. I have no idea if it ever went anywhere legally.

Your best option to get any money back is to try and shame the courier into giving you an ex gratia payment as it's likely someone in their chain is culpable. Try a polite Tweet to them and see what happens.

Without insurance no one is under any obligation to pay you the full amount.

Going "cheap" isn't usually a good option for couriers when sending high value items.

RFW

lajedop368 said:

   Ultimately we've both been shafted. He's got an empty box instead of a laptop and I've sold something which hasn't arrived.  Is it worth going to small claims or do I have no hope? Should I chalk it up to "experience"?  Annoying, but I can see them falling back on the "you didn't pay for parcel protection and we delivered it. Look, heres a photo!"   What would my next steps be? I could argue the toss that he signed for it etc but it feels immortal           

Only you, as the sender, has been shafted. The buyer should just get a refund or replacement. No one knows what they're signing for, if they've even signed for it, given most couriers are not even asking the receiver to sign any more.

blackdog2220

custardy said:

blackdog2220 said:

custardy said:

lajedop368 said:

MarkN88 said:

So what insurance did you take out? 

None. Although surely that doesn't mean they can deliver an empty box without some kind of comeback.

I almost wish it had just been "lost" as although that would be code for stolen I'd accept it as a he said she said. The fact they delivered an empty box (which the driver apparently commented felt empty) with blatent evidence of theft is worse

Seems near daily we get someone not buying insurance but questioning why they should still have cover.
now you are in a position where you are likely going to have to go small claims.

what would insurance have covered ? lost in transit , damaged in transit 

it would not have mattered if he had taken £1000 worth or insurance , as it was not lost in transit or damaged  , 

If the box is delivered empty then by its very nature it is 'lost' in transit.

the OP stated that it looked like the parcel had been opened and had been re sealed , therefore the buyer recieved and signed for one parcel that was sealed , only the sender knows what was inside the box , and indeed the comment by the delivery person "feels empty" , for all we know it may have contained a docuament 

How I can protect my Parcel: Full Cover

Our liability for lost or damaged Parcels is limited under Conditions 4 and 5. However, you can buy additional protection for loss or damage during the Order booking process. Please note that you may not be entitled to the Full Cover if your Parcel is not adequately packaged, if it is a Non-Compensation or Prohibited Item.

the hard bit now will be getting hermes to admit that the cutting of tape and resealing has in itself caused £400 of damage 

"- The tracking shows delivered, and the proof of delivery is a photo. On closer inspection you can see where the parcel tape has been cut and resealed. 

custardy

blackdog2220 said:

custardy said:

blackdog2220 said:

custardy said:

lajedop368 said:

MarkN88 said:

So what insurance did you take out? 

None. Although surely that doesn't mean they can deliver an empty box without some kind of comeback.

I almost wish it had just been "lost" as although that would be code for stolen I'd accept it as a he said she said. The fact they delivered an empty box (which the driver apparently commented felt empty) with blatent evidence of theft is worse

Seems near daily we get someone not buying insurance but questioning why they should still have cover.
now you are in a position where you are likely going to have to go small claims.

what would insurance have covered ? lost in transit , damaged in transit 

it would not have mattered if he had taken £1000 worth or insurance , as it was not lost in transit or damaged  , 

If the box is delivered empty then by its very nature it is 'lost' in transit.

the OP stated that it looked like the parcel had been opened and had been re sealed , therefore the buyer recieved and signed for one parcel that was sealed , only the sender knows what was inside the box , and indeed the comment by the delivery person "feels empty" , for all we know it may have contained a docuament 

How I can protect my Parcel: Full Cover

Our liability for lost or damaged Parcels is limited under Conditions 4 and 5. However, you can buy additional protection for loss or damage during the Order booking process. Please note that you may not be entitled to the Full Cover if your Parcel is not adequately packaged, if it is a Non-Compensation or Prohibited Item.

the hard bit now will be getting hermes to admit that the cutting of tape and resealing has in itself caused £400 of damage 

"- The tracking shows delivered, and the proof of delivery is a photo. On closer inspection you can see where the parcel tape has been cut and resealed. 

A parcel being opened in transit can very well be described as damaged.
No point arguing semantics with me. Nothing written here will change people coming here after there's a problem and not bothering with insurance/thinking through the what ifs.
Had it 'simply' been damaged/lost then they would have been in the same boat.