Repressuring combi-boiler after bleeding radiators with filling loop....?

General_query

Hi, need some help please.

After ignorantly bleeding the radiators as the bathroom one was always stone cold, the pressure has dropped to just below 0.5 on the boiler, when it's meant to be between 1.0 - 1.5 bar, I believe?
I have a filling loop but not sure what to do with it. The combi boiler is a Worcester GreenStar HE, and sticker under flap inside states Condensing Boiler ZWB 7-30  R30 HE.

Managed to find a manual to download and the page showing all the pipes underneath is below.
:

Here are the some photos I took myself:


And one I've labelled up myself showing 6 pipes (excuse the child like scribbling!), yet the manual page above only shows 5 pipes coming out undrneath.


And the filling loop I have, with 2 detachable screw "ends", and one side of the loop has a black thing to turn, excuse the lack of correct terminology.



I am aware you should turn the boiler off when attempting this, but not sure how to connect this filling loop, and to which pipes. 
Why does the manual only show 5 pipes underneath the combi boiler yet ours has 6?
Anyway, any help would be greatfully appreciated as I'd like to repressurise the combi-boiler as running a shower / bath is a no go, and I need to fill it up with water until the bar is in the healthy (safe) 1 - 1.5 bar range.

Just checked it again and it's definitely on only 0.5

Thank you in advance.

N.B. The knurled cap at the end of pipe 4 is very loose, whereas the one at the bottom of pipe 5 is well and truly screwed on / tightened, I assume to stop water flow?! 

General_query

Closer up image of 4 + 5.

Alanp

I would say you connect the filling loop to 4 &5 , it looks like you have a non return valve on the end of the flexi pipe, afaik, it looks as though it already has one on the boiler so you don’t need to use the one on the flexi, the knurled nut is a dust cap that’s why it is loose, I’m sure someone more knowledgeable will be on soon to help..

Ant555

If you look underneath your boiler  then does it have anything that looks similar to the blue lever in the picture below?
My boiler is very similar and has one of these to fill it up (pic below).  I wonder if its an optional extra but if you have one then its going to be very easy to fill.

General_query

Ant555 said:

If you look underneath your boiler  then does it have anything that looks similar to the blue lever in the picture below?
My boiler is very similar and has one of these to fill it up (pic below).  I wonder if its an optional extra but if you have one then its going to be very easy to fill.

I definitely, 100% do NOT have that! Would make like so much easier, thanks though.

General_query

Alanp said:

I would say you connect the filling loop to 4 &5 , it looks like you have a non return valve on the end of the flexi pipe, afaik, it looks as though it already has one on the boiler so you don’t need to use the one on the flexi, the knurled nut is a dust cap that’s why it is loose, I’m sure someone more knowledgeable will be on soon to help..

Thank you. The ends were loose in the bag so I just screwed a piece to each end, have now taken off the right hand side bit in top picture (with non-return valve).
How the heck do I undo the brass cap at the end of 5? So, assuming I can get that undone, connect the filling loop with the left side with black turning bit (ahem) goes onto pipe 4, and the other right hand side (with no attachment) to pipe 6.

Then I assume I turn black bit clockwise 90 degrees from the horizontal position to the vertical position to "open it" AND this bit on pipe 4 to vertical also?!


When bar is between 1 - 1.5 turn both bits to horizontal position and remove pipe, and seal ends of pipes 4 + 5, then turn boiler on!



 

General_query

Sorry, won't let me edit. That was meant to say:
So, assuming I can get that undone, connect the filling loop with the left side with black turning bit (ahem) goes onto pipe 4, and the other right hand side (with no attachment) to pipe 5.

Gunner276

Once you have the connector on I would leave it on in case you need to top up in the future

Jeepers_Creepers

General_query said:

Hi GQ.

You have a good grasp of what's involved.

In your first photo above, PIPE 4 is the cold mains inlet to your boiler. This is at mains pressure, and is what you use to supply water to repressurise your boiler. It has a screwdriver 'flat' slot in it, and this is what you use to turn on the flow. This is a bad design, as these are tricky to control; if the screwdriver slips when it's open and you cannot turn it off fast enough, or if you even turn it further the wrong way to increase the flow when you were trying to shut it off, you may end up over-pressurising the boiler! If this hits 3 bar, it'll open a release valve in the boiler, and the problem then is they have a horrible tendency to keep on dribbling afterwards = pressure drop. If you only go slightly over the 1 bar (I'd stick to '1' unless there's a good reason to go higher), you can release the excess using a rad bleed screw.

Pipe 5 is the CH's return pipe. This is where the mains water is injected in order to repressurise the boiler.

Then you have a filling loop. Unhelpfully, this loop already has the two fittings on it that are already on the boiler! So these BOTH need to be removed from the hose - simply unscrewed - until you are left with just the hose itself. (Note how the loop's valve has a black lever on it? It's a shame that isn't on the boiler's valve as it's much easier to control).

Finally, in your last pic, you can see the longer fitting has a white cap thingy inside it? This is a one-way valve. Water can be forced in past that valve, but it won't come back out that way. That is the same as the fitting on PIPE 5. Ie, once you remove the bottom cap of PIPE 5, water shouldn't come out because that's a one-way valve.

Soooo, this is what to do :-)

1) Remove both fittings from that filling loop. The hose is now symmetrical - it is just a 'hose' and it doesn't matter which way around it's connected.

2) unscrew the cap on the end of PIPE 4's isolating valve. Nothing will come out until you - slowly - turn that screw slot.

3) Remove the 'cap'/ end of the non-return valve on PIPE 5. Nothing should come out - it's non return, innit.

4) Screw on the filling loop to both. I'm hoping that the inside of the hose fittings has rubber washers in them? If so, just do up the fittings hand-tight. Check that is screws on easily and smoothly, and then 'seats' firmly. The hose end, where it goes in to the hose's end fitting, should not be loose or turnable when the fitting is done up.

All good? Cool.

5) Turn off the boiler. You have an analogue pressure gauge, so this will still register. With a neat-fitting screwdriver, slowly turn the screw slot (don't ask me which way...). As soon as you hear the hisss of water, stop and watch the gauge. Keep clear in your head which way you turned the screw, so's you shut it off the reverse way. Once you hit 1 bar or fractionally above, shut it off. Breathe deeply.

Undo hose, replace caps.

6) Curse, loudly and vehemently, the name of the plumber who installed the boiler and didn't set it up for the owner to refill.

General_query

Jeepers_Creepers said:

General_query said:

Hi GQ.

You have a good grasp of what's involved.

In your first photo above, PIPE 4 is the cold mains inlet to your boiler. This is at mains pressure, and is what you use to supply water to repressurise your boiler. It has a screwdriver 'flat' slot in it, and this is what you use to turn on the flow. This is a bad design, as these are tricky to control; if the screwdriver slips when it's open and you cannot turn it off fast enough, or if you even turn it further the wrong way to increase the flow when you were trying to shut it off, you may end up over-pressurising the boiler! If this hits 3 bar, it'll open a release valve in the boiler, and the problem then is they have a horrible tendency to keep on dribbling afterwards = pressure drop. If you only go slightly over the 1 bar (I'd stick to '1' unless there's a good reason to go higher), you can release the excess using a rad bleed screw.

Pipe 5 is the CH's return pipe. This is where the mains water is injected in order to repressurise the boiler.

Then you have a filling loop. Unhelpfully, this loop already has the two fittings on it that are already on the boiler! So these BOTH need to be removed from the hose - simply unscrewed - until you are left with just the hose itself. (Note how the loop's valve has a black lever on it? It's a shame that isn't on the boiler's valve as it's much easier to control).

Finally, in your last pic, you can see the longer fitting has a white cap thingy inside it? This is a one-way valve. Water can be forced in past that valve, but it won't come back out that way. That is the same as the fitting on PIPE 5. Ie, once you remove the bottom cap of PIPE 5, water shouldn't come out because that's a one-way valve.

Soooo, this is what to do :-)

1) Remove both fittings from that filling loop. The hose is now symmetrical - it is just a 'hose' and it doesn't matter which way around it's connected.

2) unscrew the cap on the end of PIPE 4's isolating valve. Nothing will come out until you - slowly - turn that screw slot.

3) Remove the 'cap'/ end of the non-return valve on PIPE 5. Nothing should come out - it's non return, innit.

4) Screw on the filling loop to both. I'm hoping that the inside of the hose fittings has rubber washers in them? If so, just do up the fittings hand-tight. Check that is screws on easily and smoothly, and then 'seats' firmly. The hose end, where it goes in to the hose's end fitting, should not be loose or turnable when the fitting is done up.

All good? Cool.

5) Turn off the boiler. You have an analogue pressure gauge, so this will still register. With a neat-fitting screwdriver, slowly turn the screw slot (don't ask me which way...). As soon as you hear the hisss of water, stop and watch the gauge. Keep clear in your head which way you turned the screw, so's you shut it off the reverse way. Once you hit 1 bar or fractionally above, shut it off. Breathe deeply.

Undo hose, replace caps.

6) Curse, loudly and vehemently, the name of the plumber who installed the boiler and didn't set it up for the owner to refill.

nd up over-pressurising the boiler! If this hits 3 bar, it'll open a release valve in the boiler, and the problem then is they have a horrible tendency to keep on dribbling afterwards = pressure drop. If you only go slightly over the 1 bar (I'd stick to '1' unless there's a good reason to go higher), you can release the excess using a rad bleed screw.

Pipe 5 is the CH's return pipe. This is where the mains water is injected in order to repressurise the boiler.

Then you have a filling loop. Unhelpfully, this loop already has the two fittings on it that are already on the boiler! So these BOTH need to be removed from the hose - simply unscrewed - until you are left with just the hose itself. (Note how the loop's valve has a black lever on it? It's a shame that isn't on the boiler's valve as it's much easier to control).

Finally, in your last pic, you can see the longer fitting has a white cap thingy inside it? This is a one-way valve. Water can be forced in past that valve, but it won't come back out that way. That is the same as the fitting on PIPE 5. Ie, once you remove the bottom cap of PIPE 5, water shouldn't come out because that's a one-way valve.

Soooo, this is what to do :-)

1) Remove both fittings from that filling loop. The hose is now symmetrical - it is just a 'hose' and it doesn't matter which way around it's connected.

2) unscrew the cap on the end of PIPE 4's isolating valve. Nothing will come out until you - slowly - turn that screw slot.

3) Remove the 'cap'/ end of the non-return valve on PIPE 5. Nothing should come out - it's non return, innit.

4) Screw on the filling loop to both. I'm hoping that the inside of the hose fittings has rubber washers in them? If so, just do up the fittings hand-tight. Check that is screws on easily and smoothly, and then 'seats' firmly. The hose end, where it goes in to the hose's end fitting, should not be loose or turnable when the fitting is done up.

All good? Cool.

5) Turn off the boiler. You have an analogue pressure gauge, so this will still register. With a neat-fitting screwdriver, slowly turn the screw slot (don't ask me which way...). As soon as you hear the hisss of water, stop and watch the gauge. Keep clear in your head which way you turned the screw, so's you shut it off the reverse way. Once you hit 1 bar or fractionally above, shut it off. Breathe deeply.

Undo hose, replace caps.

6) Curse, loudly and vehemently, the name of the plumber who installed the boiler and didn't set it up for the owner to refill.

Thank you so much, you have no idea how much I appreciate this help & advice.
Just a final question, as the end 'brass cap' at the end of pipe 5 is rock solid and won't undo with a normal spanner due to the knurled grooves / vertical lines, will these curved locking jaw pliers do?
Need to reserve a pair and get to Screwfix after work to collect them ASAP.



https://www.screwfix.com/p/curved-jaw-locking-pliers-7-180mm/7595v
https://media.screwfix.com/is/image//ae235?src=ae235/7595V_P&$prodImageLarge$
Thank you everyone.

Alanp

Would it not make more sense to leave the black isolator in place? Then you can use the lever to better regulate the flow just leave the penny valve isolator open and turn off the black one, good idea to leave in place for future filling