Query around furlough agreement

FuzzyDuck1

Hi
A company sends a letter 25th March asking for permission to furlough or flexi furlough you. It stipulates 1st April to 31st May 2020 and you sign it. Then 31st March you get a letter stating you’re fully furloughed until 31st May 2020. You get called back full time since 8th May 2020 and do your full contractual 40 hours per week from then on. Can the company flexi furlough you again without your agreement , notification or discussion? 

Jeremy535897

Not based on what you have said, unless the earlier letter said more than you suggest. (I cannot imagine it made any reference to flexi furlough, for example.)

MattMattMattUK

In addition to the above, whilst it is against the rules of the scheme to furlough employees without the correct documentation you have yo take into account that your employer will be furloughing you because of lack of work and funds. The alternative to the furlough scheme is redundancy, being a "difficult" employee might not be the wisest move.

FuzzyDuck1

MattMattMattUK said:

In addition to the above, whilst it is against the rules of the scheme to furlough employees without the correct documentation you have yo take into account that your employer will be furloughing you because of lack of work and funds. The alternative to the furlough scheme is redundancy, being a "difficult" employee might not be the wisest move.

Thank you. In this situation there’s been work throughout since 8th May 2020 and was furloughed for an afternoon in January 2021. The notice came through whilst on a job and no other details were received for example how that would affect pay for that afternoon. I completely understand your point about why they would do this during this time but it’s resulted in the rest of the months pay to be incorrect and struggling to get the employer to pay the amount. Was expecting 20% reduction on the 4 hours furlough which equates to approx £21 but was stopped £166! Having gone around in circles with the hr manager she keeps telling me to go back to the initial letter from back in March last year saying I’d agreed to accept less wages as a result. 

FuzzyDuck1

Jeremy535897 said:

Not based on what you have said, unless the earlier letter said more than you suggest. (I cannot imagine it made any reference to flexi furlough, for example.)

Here are the only letters received. The first letter received did seek consent to be furloughed or short timed but was dated to end 31st May 2020 and also said any extension would be given in writing. Second letter placed as a fully furloughed Worker. Can the company then put me on flexi without discussing it first or another agreement being in place?

Jeremy535897

The second letter requests that you provide an email address in the event that they cannot send you a letter, and to update you regarding length of furlough, pay etc. Did you do that, and did you receive any such emails? If not, then I cannot see how they could furlough you for an afternoon in January. Concerning the quantum of pay, when the HR manager refers you back to the letter of 25 March, point out that it states that you will receive 80% of reference salary when furloughed, and that if you receive less than that, their CJRS claim is invalid.

Be aware that they may refer you to the lay off paragraph, and ask if that is what you would prefer.

FuzzyDuck1

Jeremy535897 said:

The second letter requests that you provide an email address in the event that they cannot send you a letter, and to update you regarding length of furlough, pay etc. Did you do that, and did you receive any such emails? If not, then I cannot see how they could furlough you for an afternoon in January. Concerning the quantum of pay, when the HR manager refers you back to the letter of 25 March, point out that it states that you will receive 80% of reference salary when furloughed, and that if you receive less than that, their CJRS claim is invalid.

Be aware that they may refer you to the lay off paragraph, and ask if that is what you would prefer.

Thank you, personal email was provided as-well as the company email they have. Nothing has been received by email. There was a standard email that was circulated in July 2020 saying that full furlough employees would get a letter sent but flexi furlough would be advised through the internal log system. That’s how January’s half day was sent. But it didn’t give any other details. Queried it right away and was told they could do it. Then when pay day came around they have massively fudged the wages up. Usually get x amount per month that doesn’t vary. The company have disclosed that they have worked it out on an hourly basis for furlough reasons but I’m not an hourly paid employee and their figures just don’t add up to what I usually pick up. They are refusing to pay the difference in pay when I worked all but 4 hours. This is why they have referred me back to the initial agreement from last year saying they can furlough me whenever they like and only have to pay me for “hours worked in that month” since that letter was signed. But I don’t get paid that way usually as my salary split into equal monthly instalments.  Upon receipt of my payslips (asked for the last 12 months to be sent due to this error) i noticed on September and October last year when I took a couple of days holiday entitlement that they’d put those days through as furlough too. I got paid my usual salary so didn’t even open my payslip as there was nothing different to check. Surely they can’t put me on furlough just because I’m on paid annual leave either? I’m only interested in getting paid what I’m entitled to. I’m not out to get the company but with them refusing my pay and sticking this document in my face every time I ask it to be looked into further I fear the only way this is going to go is south. Really hoping to avoid that but trying to figure out where I stand legally. ACAS weren’t much help although did say they couldn’t change me from salaried to hourly pay without my permission. Thanks 

FuzzyDuck1

Also note the “furlough” column reflects what the company seem to have claimed for the 4 hours @ 80% although following the government’s guidance on working it out there’s a few pound difference. It’s more the fact that they pay me differently because they claimed furlough and said that they’ve paid me correctly when it’s clear they haven’t. It’s not £10 or so we’re talking here it’s £166 and I agreed in that letter to receiving 80% of the hours furloughed (nothing above that) and they’re arguing they they can as I’d agreed to a reduced salary in that letter. I had absolutely no clue that after 31st March my contract would be anything but going back to the original terms. 

Jeremy535897

Your reference salary for furlough, assuming you are a fixed rate employee, is what you were entitled to for the last pay period before 20 March 2020. It should be straightforward to calculate an hourly rate from that (reduced to 80%). There is detailed government guidance for employers:
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/find-examples-to-help-you-work-out-80-of-your-employees-wages/examples-of-how-to-work-out-80-of-your-employees-wages-national-insurance-contributions-and-pension-contributions#min-pay-flexi

See also https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/treasury-direction-made-under-sections-71-and-76-of-the-coronavirus-act-2020/further-treasury-direction-made-on-25-june-2020-under-sections-71-and-76-of-the-coronavirus-act-2020

FuzzyDuck1

Jeremy535897 said:

Your reference salary for furlough, assuming you are a fixed rate employee, is what you were entitled to for the last pay period before 20 March 2020. It should be straightforward to calculate an hourly rate from that (reduced to 80%). There is detailed government guidance for employers:
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/find-examples-to-help-you-work-out-80-of-your-employees-wages/examples-of-how-to-work-out-80-of-your-employees-wages-national-insurance-contributions-and-pension-contributions#min-pay-flexi

See also https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/treasury-direction-made-under-sections-71-and-76-of-the-coronavirus-act-2020/further-treasury-direction-made-on-25-june-2020-under-sections-71-and-76-of-the-coronavirus-act-2020

Thank you. The first link is the same example I used in working out mute furlough pay. Am I therefore correct in thinking that my monthly salary should only be short by 20% of the 4 hours furlough payment? I’ve calculated that 20% of 4 hours work is £21 or thereabouts. I’ve been short paid £166 from my monthly salary. Thanks 

2nd link. Thank you. Interesting read. I can see that if an agreement between my employer and I was in existence they’d be able to continue to use the scheme. However, ive not even had a call from my employer to say that there may be short time periods this month or that month or even on a weekly basis and how it would affect me.My job (other than for 5 weeks last year when the country went into first lockdown) hasn’t been affected as such as I’ve always worked 40 hours or more since returning. 

FuzzyDuck1

My employment contract states I work 40 hours per week for my salary. Therefore the years total of hours is paid in equal monthly instalments. By the employer then only paying me for actual days worked I’m being done out of some days pay. I get paid for 21.75 days per month. They only paid me for 20 days in January where the short fall is. But if I’m not furloughed next month etc I’ll pick up 21.75 days pay. So where does that 1.75 days pay go?