CCJ for a private firm parking ticket- incidental find. All correspondence went to old address.

Umkomaas

Also what is trade COP ?

The Accredited Trade Association's Code of Practice - IPC or BPA as appropriate (there's only two of them!). 

Coupon-mad

Yes add what @henrik777 says. 

Copy from another thread, there are shedloads...just look in the first ten pages of the forum and click on any with CCJ in the title.  There are two right under your thread right now.  I am not going to link them...I never do, you need to use the forum like a book, reading the relevant pages (CCJ threads) that are (regardless of the PPC) exactly like your own case.  They are all the same and people have already done what @henrik777 is saying.

Also what is trade COP ?

Thw BPA Code of Practice, which requires a PPC to check an address if they haven't heard from a motorist.  Has your solicitor not looked at the CoP?

Herbie2312

Coupon-mad said:

Yes add what @henrik777 says. 

Copy from another thread, there are shedloads...just look in the first ten pages of the forum and click on any with CCJ in the title

Also what is trade COP ?

Thw BPA Code of Practice, which requires a PPC to check an address if they haven't heard from a motorist.  Has your solicitor not looked at the CoP?

Hmm good point Coupon , I'll be mentioning this to her for sure tomorrow and asking her why she did  not include it in my witness statement. Fuming. Is there any other points I can make that will strengthen my case? 

Coupon-mad

Did she write that WS?  Flipping heck.

Is there any other points I can make that will strengthen my case? 

Yes, the ones you find on the other current CCJ set aside threads right next to your own! 

The stuff @henrik777 said is standard and is ALREADY HERE on shedloads of threads. 

Herbie2312

Coupon-mad said:

Did she write that WS?  Flipping heck.

Is there any other points I can make that will strengthen my case? 

Yes, the ones you find on the other current CCJ set aside threads right next to your own! 

The stuff @henrik777 said is standard and is ALREADY HERE on shedloads of threads. 

I have looked many times on the other threads but often people have other defence points and I havent seen one when the only defence is like mine, that the letters went to an old address because v5 was not updated. Most others have other reasons which makes the ws specific to them and mind boggling to read  
Although I take your point and will search again with a fine tooth comb. 

Johnersh

The witness statement is seemingly suboptimal.

As far as I can tell, not only does it not properly set out why the judgment should be set aside, majoring on the reasons why the claimant should've searched at a new address (ie not relied on the foreseeable claimant argument that the dvla address was a last known address), but it leaves the o/p with nowhere to go: "I would've paid the PCN had I been aware of it" thereby admitting liability for the primary debt.  The bolt on £60+ is still fair game, perhaps. 

Unless the court is convinced the set aside is mandatory (cpr 13.2), there's no plan B as the o/p won't be able to meet the (relatively low) bar that there is a real prospect of defending the claim (cpr 13.3).

Johnersh

The onus is, of course, on the claimant to issue correctly.

If you can, get a statement from the householder that s/he received no post. The o/p's evidence on that is hearsay and close to meaningless. Get the real deal. 

I mean basically, they will have had shed loads of pre-action correspondence not responded to. That gives rise to at least the possibility that the o/p no longer resided at that address. 

This is entirely common. Lots of people move. A credit check prior to issue can be done for something like £2 to avoid this issue and is a cost which would've been recoverable inter partes, so why not do it? 

The fact is that the ppc were ambivalent as a nil response suited their purposes, as did a default judgment. Read Sajid v Nuur and the submissions of Charles Bagot QC (now a Deputy Master of the High Court). In that appeal, you will see the effort/steps expected prior to issue. 

All of that can still be raised in oral submission. Your solicitor may wish to file a skelly 24hrs before. 

 

Herbie2312

Johnersh said:

The witness statement is seemingly suboptimal.

As far as I can tell, not only does it not properly set out why the judgment should be set aside, majoring on the reasons why the claimant should've searched at a new address (ie not relied on the foreseeable claimant argument that the dvla address was a last known address), but it leaves the o/p with nowhere to go: "I would've paid the PCN had I been aware of it" thereby admitting liability for the primary debt.  The bolt on £60+ is still fair game, perhaps. 

Unless the court is convinced the set aside is mandatory (cpr 13.2), there's no plan B as the o/p won't be able to meet the (relatively low) bar that there is a real prospect of defending the claim (cpr 13.3).

Thank you for your input  I do appreciate it. Can you clarify what you mean by the bolt on £60 is still fair game?

The reason  I wrote that I would have paid the debt if I was aware was because I was not at this point thinking of a defence to the ticket only that I had not received the letters . The fines were  issued  in early 2019 and I became aware of the ccj in late jan 2021. My memory of what had happened on the day of the parking fines was nil. Had I received the fines at the time eg windscreen ticket or if they traced me to my correct address would have had a chance to put a defence forward. This is all 2 years after the fines were issued and I panicked only being able to see the ccj and not whether the fines were justifiable in the first place. 
Is it too late now to rewrite my entire witness statement? hearing is 19th may 

Johnersh

The PCN was for £100.  It is the fact that it has not been paid and they've issued proceedings that has led them to add the additional charging.

But just because you admit to the PCN doesn't mean that you admit they are entitled to recover additional charges. Again, there's lots on these in the forum. I take the view that where those charges are generic and not to indemnify actisl costs, they can and should be specified in the contract terms on the sign. 

1505grandad

Please do not refer to the speculative invoice as a "fine" in any correspondence.