Neighbour Noise Complaint but no loud noise

dori2o

We had new neighbours move in 4 months ago after our previous neighbour sadly passed away.

The house is now being rented out by our previous neighbours family who have rented to a couple with 2 young children.

We have not changed any of our habits and having been here 17 years, we have never had any complaint of noise from either side.

We live in an 1880's brick built 2 up 2 down terraced house (railwaymans cottage) which is ours, i.e. not rented.

Recently I did a little bit of DIY and having lost track of time it was 9pm when I finished.

The next day we got a snotty letter through the door telling us how the neighbour felt it utterly unfair that we had disturbed their 4yr old sleep to the point they were almost in tears at the 'constant banging' ( there was no banging, but admittedly about 6 screws were driven into the floorboards/joists quite late on.

They finished by saying that if ANY (capitalised in their letter) DIY was done in future after 8pm they would contact the council and Police, plus make contact our Landlord (which we dont have as the house is mine, but several other houses on the street are rented, approx 60/40 are owned/rented).
I admit it was my error with the DIY and since any work we've had done has finished well before 8pm.

However, now the neighbour has taken to banging on the walls and shouting for my daughter (age 19) to turn her TV down at 8.30pm as they have a 4yr old who cannot sleep.

The TV is not loud.  Mostly she's playing on her Xbox or Nintendo Switch, but watches YouTube vids before going to sleep.

My daughter is in the room at the back of the house with us at the front separated by a timber/plaster partition wall.

The TV is located directly beside the partition wall between daughters room and ours and is on a stand on top of her chest of drawers on the party wall side of the room. (So it's in the corner of daughters room)

At night we cannot her any more than a very very slight murmur from her TV, and I mean very slight.

I can hear traffic on the roads outside over any noise from the TV, and that's with double glazing.

There is a solid brick wall between us and them, so I cannot see how they feel the noise from the TV is so loud.

It is not attached to the wall and there are no external speakers either (i.e. there is NO surround sound/5.1 system/soundbar etc.)

Again I admit I was wrong with the DIY, but is it right for the neighbour to be banging on the wall at 8:30pm demanding my daughter 'shut that TV off now' ?

We often hear, and are woken by their children, running and banging around at 5am, but we accept it's a part of life having had our own 5 and 7 yr olds in the past, and we dont bang on the walls asking them to shut up.

At no point have they come to the door to speak, just posted a note through the door.

I was inclined to go round and try to discuss but I'm not the one with the problem.

We've also been told by friends over the road who have spoken to them that they are calling us lazy wasters and dole scroungers cause they never see us go to work.

Well that's right, we no longer physically go to the office as we work from home.  All 3 if us work at the same place and we have all been working from home since March and will be for the foreseeable future, potentially indefinitely.

I could very well make a complaint about how they label us to other neighbours, but I cannot be bothered with the tit-for-tat nature of that.

We live a quiet life (or thought we did), and that's all we want.

This likely means nothing at all but our house is supposedly haunted. A woman was murdered and thrown down the stairs in the house almost 100 years ago.
Although the stairs are no longer in that location (the house was remodeled in the early 70's and the stairs moved from their traditional place in the centre of the house between front and rear reception rooms, to the side wall, and the front/rear reception rooms knocked through), there is often a shadow on the stairs that moves up and down very slowly which is not caused by any lighting inside/outside the house,  and also the cats we have often become transfixed by something on the stairs despite their being absutely nothing there.

Other than that nothing else and it's never bothered us.

Anyhow, back to this supposed noise complaint.
Does anyone have any advice on how to proceed?

Has anyone had this issue?

What 'rights' does the neighbour have regards this supposed noise complaint?

Does my daughter have to turn down the TV when they 'demand'?

Many Thanks in advance

Doozergirl

I don't think your neighbour has any 'rights' when it comes to the shared noises of living at reasonable times of day.  

The only thing I can think of is to be nice to them.  It might be that you can talk reasonably to them about the issues, but something tells me otherwise if they've got the nerve to be making up their own reality
and telling the neighbours what kind of people you are.  

We had neighbours just like that.  I didn't realise quite how big a strain they put on our lives until they moved.  They spread malicious gossip about us to the other neighbours and complained to environmental health about us, to the point that my husband made friends with the EH man, who eventually said he would not be coming out in response to any more complaints.   It's not something that had ever happened before to us and, tellingly, didn't happen in the 6.5 years we lived there with new neighbours after they moved.  

The new neighbours were real people and accepted that we were too.    Some noise through a party wall is to be expected most people know what is reasonable and just get used to some level of noise.   If I sat in absolutely silence, I could hear them singing, shouting at the dog to be quiet, hoovering etc. just living their lives, but most of the time we're making our own noise too and I was unaware of next door. 

You sound pretty reasonable to me, you've thought about things that you can do to mitigate something that might be a particular nuisance.  Can your daughter move rooms so that particular room is quieter at those times or wear headphones?  You might want to consider those things, but I certainly don't blame you if you don't.  They're things that your neighbours could also consider! 

When my kids were little, it had nothing to do with neighbour noise, but they had hundreds of CD books to listen to and I'd put those on for them to go to sleep to.  They've turned out fine.  The expectation of silence isn't a very reasonable one at an hour when everyone is at home and most people are awake.   

Good luck.  Maybe they'll move soon...

Wanderingpomm

The lease for my flat (which I own) says no noise between 11pm - 7am and the neighbours still put their washing on at 10:30pm so your DIY seems not be unreasonable. Have you thought of banging back when you hear anything? 

Apart from that write to their landlords and report them for harassment. You have a right to quiet enjoyment too and they are bully’s 

TELLIT01

TV, radio or music doesn't been to be played particularly loudly for the bass to vibrate through walls and can potentially actually be more apparent to people in other rooms.  Maybe that is the main issue.  Without talking to them you will never know, or be able to find out if there is an easy resolution.

It is certainly not reasonable for the neighbours to expect your family to be silent, or near to, because of their children.

Jeepers_Creepers

As above.

It would appear that these neighbs have unrealistic expectations. Yes, you once made DIY noise at a late hour, and yes that can be considered unreasonable. However, it was a one-of error for which you apologised and assured them of no repeat, whilst they over-egged the noise level and were tetchy about it to say the least.

So you know what you are dealing with.

How do you respond? By being the complete opposite of them. Friendly friendly friendly, nice big smile, don't get drawn in to any silly arguments or diversions ('diversion' is a well-known tactic of the empathy-devoid), and just stick to the facts - whilst being gently assertive about the reality of the situation; "Can I apologise again for the DIY that evening - that was my mistake as I'd lost track of the time. Sorry you are being disturbed by other everyday noises from our home, but that's a fact of life in semis and terraced houses - and goes both ways. We hear your TV, music, children playing and running about, doors being opened and closed (don't say 'slammed' - keep it passive), and even your lovely little baby crying. We accept it as much as we can as being normal family sounds. We are careful to keep the noise we make to acceptable and normal levels too, but we understand that some sounds will travel through shared walls; it's unreasonable to for one side to become completely silent. As I said, it works both ways..."

How this progresses will depend on their response. I suspect they won't be contrite. In which case - again super-calm and reasonable-voiced - "Ah, well, if you really think we are being unreasonably noisy, then you may wish to contact Environmental Health - that's the correct thing to do." If you want - if they deserve it - you can add "...and not talk to neighbours behind our backs instead" (delivered with an angelic smile).

That will become your mantra - 'contact EH if you really believe it's an issue'.

Note down every conversation you have with them - words used and the manner in which it was delivered. If they are genuinely belligerent, then I'd also surreptitiously record them. You are hoping this will be resolved, but are preparing for it escalating.

YOU be smiles and reasonable at all times.

Oh, and if their manner becomes what could be considered bullying or harassment, contact your local friendly bobby sooner rather than later.

welshmoneylover

I I got neighbours like this who complain over the silliest thing and the only way I deal with it is to go grey rock and not give them any ammunition to use.

Janxx

Take no notice. I had the same with with my neighbours from hell. I received a letter from the council about a noise complaint but obviously did not state who made it. I phoned the council explaining I live on my own, worked shifts and was in bed by 9pm most nights. They were very good, big hinted they often get malicious complaints like this and have sent out to the complainants a noise diary. Needles to say nothing came of it!
I think a lot of it comes from jealousy. Some cannot see that people do actually work from home.  

dori2o

Thanks all.

We are going to follow the advice and not react to anything until we have to.

If we see them we'll be polite, say hello and leave it at that until they approach us, but we will only respond to verbal contact, I'm not getting involved in silly back of envelope note passing between houses.

We'll have to see how it goes.

Thanks Again.

theoretica

How is the TV mounted?  As mentioned above it might be bass sounds travelling as vibrations which can be easily reduced by sitting it/the speakers on a foam pad.

babyshoes

theoretica said:

How is the TV mounted?  As mentioned above it might be bass sounds travelling as vibrations which can be easily reduced by sitting it/the speakers on a foam pad.

This is a good suggestion. We once had neighbours who didn't speak enough English to understand that the bass levels on their sound system were set too high. They'd turn the volume down when we let them know we could hear the music, but even when the volume was very low, we could still hear the bass through the walls. 

twopenny

Was there originally a fireplace where the chimney is between the two walls?

My neighbour put her radio on her mantlepiece and it came through loud and clear in all rooms on that side and her side the chimney was blocked in, on mine only a small air vent for the fire but the noise still travelled and echoed.

It may also be that the childs room is directly behind.

Could your daughter move the TV to another location? Then see if they still complain. If so then they are fibbing.

As for the DIY it was a one off mistake. Ignore that altogether.

As for the malicious words to the neighbours let it ride. The more rope you give them the more they are likely to take until it becomes obvious to everyone what they are like. I had a mad aunt that did that to me when my Grandmother dies and she went house to house slating me. By leaving her to it eventually the sympathy was on my side