Another Storage Heater Thread

supermario64

macman said:

What proportion of your annual kWh usage is currently on cheap rate? With only one working NSH, and presumably an immersion heater, it's unlikely to be enough to make E7 an economical tariff.

54% on the cheap rate, I time the washer dryer only to go on during the night. Plus all the water heating. I think it's still worth this tariff? What's a good benchmark to aim for, over 60-70%?

macman said:

CU: it's hard to see clearly, but 3 of the 16A MCB's on the left side appear to be marked 'store rad' or similar, which indicates that you already have a radial circuit wired to each NSH, as they should be. These should be hard wired at each NSH for the E7 cheap rate side: the convector can run off the 13A ring main.

Just did some tests: each storage heater has its own switch (those three on the left marked with "store") which turn the electric plug they're connected to off. The other switch the living room storage heater is connected to (for convection) seems to be controlled one of the "socket" switches which turns off every device connected to the living room sockets. So it does look like they're somehow wired separately, hopefully the electrician can get this timed properly to the cheap E7 hours.

Gerry1

supermario64 said:

macman said:

What proportion of your annual kWh usage is currently on cheap rate? With only one working NSH, and presumably an immersion heater, it's unlikely to be enough to make E7 an economical tariff.

54% on the cheap rate, I time the washer dryer only to go on during the night. Plus all the water heating. I think it's still worth this tariff? What's a good benchmark to aim for, over 60-70%?

Forget the percentages, just get quotations for E7 and single rate (by saying you don't have E7) and choose whichever will be cheaper.  Many suppliers won't even need a meter change for single rate, they'll just bill both registers at the same rate.  However, at a whopping 54%, E7 is virtually guaranteed to be cheaper.

danrv

Gerry1 said:

danrv said:

No E7 timer? 

Apparently it's built in to the Landis + Gyr 5246C meter.  The OP needs to look at the meter to see exactly when it switches over

Ok. Can’t see anything stated on the front, not even Multi-rate.
Good idea to check the switching times. Somewhere around 12.00 - 7.00am.
Took me a while to figure my E10 switching times as they’re seven hours out.
As mentioned, a good electrician would be able to sort it. 

There’s discontinued Creda TSR storage heaters available quite cheap on EBay if 
the current ones can’t be fixed easily.

Gerry1

danrv said:

Gerry1 said:

danrv said:

No E7 timer? 

Apparently it's built in to the Landis + Gyr 5246C meter.  The OP needs to look at the meter to see exactly when it switches over

Can’t see anything stated on the front, not even Multi-rate.

The clues are that there's a Cycle Display button, it has five ports with two brown live outputs (presumably one off peak and one 24h) and that the OP's bills show they're billed for 54% night usage.

macman

If you are getting 54% off peak already, then E7 is a no-brainer: it can break even as low as 20% for some people, through 33% is a better benchmark. It depends on the particular tariff. I'm frankly amazed that you are getting that percentage off one NSH and an immersion heater, plus the w/m. It means that your overall daytime usage must be very low.
The CU is wired correctly to the heaters. The issue is the upstream connection into the E7 meter.

danrv

Gerry1 said:

danrv said:

Gerry1 said:

The clues are that there's a Cycle Display button, it has five ports with two brown live outputs (presumably one off peak and one 24h) and that the OP's bills show they're billed for 54% night usage.

Missed the 54% bit but noticed the five ports. As none of the heaters are taking a charge, cheap rate consumption could be mostly down to hot water immersion. 

Talldave

supermario64 said:

macman said:

What proportion of your annual kWh usage is currently on cheap rate? With only one working NSH, and presumably an immersion heater, it's unlikely to be enough to make E7 an economical tariff.

54% on the cheap rate, I time the washer dryer only to go on during the night. Plus all the water heating. I think it's still worth this tariff? What's a good benchmark to aim for, over 60-70%?

macman said:

CU: it's hard to see clearly, but 3 of the 16A MCB's on the left side appear to be marked 'store rad' or similar, which indicates that you already have a radial circuit wired to each NSH, as they should be. These should be hard wired at each NSH for the E7 cheap rate side: the convector can run off the 13A ring main.

Just did some tests: each storage heater has its own switch (those three on the left marked with "store") which turn the electric plug they're connected to off. The other switch the living room storage heater is connected to (for convection) seems to be controlled one of the "socket" switches which turns off every device connected to the living room sockets. So it does look like they're somehow wired separately, hopefully the electrician can get this timed properly to the cheap E7 hours.

If your tests are turning the storage heaters on/off then either someone has modified consumer unit to 24hr on both halves or the smart meter is leaving the off peak output live 24/7. Do they do this if configured as non-E7 perhaps??

Gerry1

Talldave said:

supermario64 said:

macman said:

What proportion of your annual kWh usage is currently on cheap rate? With only one working NSH, and presumably an immersion heater, it's unlikely to be enough to make E7 an economical tariff.

54% on the cheap rate, I time the washer dryer only to go on during the night. Plus all the water heating. I think it's still worth this tariff? What's a good benchmark to aim for, over 60-70%?

macman said:

CU: it's hard to see clearly, but 3 of the 16A MCB's on the left side appear to be marked 'store rad' or similar, which indicates that you already have a radial circuit wired to each NSH, as they should be. These should be hard wired at each NSH for the E7 cheap rate side: the convector can run off the 13A ring main.

Just did some tests: each storage heater has its own switch (those three on the left marked with "store") which turn the electric plug they're connected to off. The other switch the living room storage heater is connected to (for convection) seems to be controlled one of the "socket" switches which turns off every device connected to the living room sockets. So it does look like they're somehow wired separately, hopefully the electrician can get this timed properly to the cheap E7 hours.

If your tests are turning the storage heaters on/off then either someone has modified consumer unit to 24hr on both halves or the smart meter is leaving the off peak output live 24/7. Do they do this if configured as non-E7 perhaps??

It's not a smart meter and it must be configured for E7 because the night register is clocking up 54% usage.

Talldave

Gerry1 said:

Talldave said:

supermario64 said:

macman said:

What proportion of your annual kWh usage is currently on cheap rate? With only one working NSH, and presumably an immersion heater, it's unlikely to be enough to make E7 an economical tariff.

54% on the cheap rate, I time the washer dryer only to go on during the night. Plus all the water heating. I think it's still worth this tariff? What's a good benchmark to aim for, over 60-70%?

macman said:

CU: it's hard to see clearly, but 3 of the 16A MCB's on the left side appear to be marked 'store rad' or similar, which indicates that you already have a radial circuit wired to each NSH, as they should be. These should be hard wired at each NSH for the E7 cheap rate side: the convector can run off the 13A ring main.

Just did some tests: each storage heater has its own switch (those three on the left marked with "store") which turn the electric plug they're connected to off. The other switch the living room storage heater is connected to (for convection) seems to be controlled one of the "socket" switches which turns off every device connected to the living room sockets. So it does look like they're somehow wired separately, hopefully the electrician can get this timed properly to the cheap E7 hours.

If your tests are turning the storage heaters on/off then either someone has modified consumer unit to 24hr on both halves or the smart meter is leaving the off peak output live 24/7. Do they do this if configured as non-E7 perhaps??

It's not a smart meter and it must be configured for E7 because the night register is clocking up 54% usage.

So how was OP able to turn E7 circuits off and on at 3pm?

danrv

Surely there’s an indicator on the meter to show which rate is active?
Supplier stated times may not tally with the timer at all.