Being pushed out. What to do?

AskAsk

you can't claim constructive dismissal if you resign as they haven't dismissed you.

sebtomato

AskAsk said:

you can't claim constructive dismissal if you resign as they haven't dismissed you.

Yes you can. Maybe you are confusing it with unfair dismissal...

sebtomato

theoretica said:

sebtomato said:

Marcon said:

Have you any idea how difficult it is to prove constructive dismissal - or how long it will take to even get a tribunal hearing, because they don't sound as if they are going to roll over any time soon if you do 'go after them' as you put it. Have you actually had any sort of discussion about this apparent change in how 'management' perceives you? Is this one new manager, or a new management team? Is your old manager still around and is there any prospect of changing your line manager? Doing nothing and letting your anxiety and resentment fester won't help, so you need to do something, if only to find out why you have gone from golden boy (or girl) to class dunce in one easy lesson.

Having said all that, it sounds as if your face no longer fits, for whatever reason, and moving on would be the logical thing to do IF you can find a new job and get a reasonable reference from your current employer. 

My company wouldn't go to tribunal and risk any negative publicity, so they would surely settle first. 
There is no prospect of changing line manager, I have asked his management. Their answer was: "make it work".
My performance is quite measurable in term of revenue and profit, so there is no question about it and no reasons to have a significant drop in pay this year.
I think it's just a case of me being seen as too expensive or my "face no longer fitting" as you put it. My management may not perceive me well, but my colleagues and customers do (and have stated in writing).
In term of reference, large companies only give a factual reference now anyway (basically confirming the role and employment time).

How does your packet compare with colleagues?  Could the new manager think it would be cheaper to have the work done by other people, either because your individual package is high, or because the the reward structure is overly generous to top performers?

Good question. I don't know how much my colleagues are paid. Information is not disclosed. I am more senior than most colleagues doing a similar job, some of them much older than me. I have had many promotions, pay rises and other benefits increase each year, so in absolute terms, I am expensive. However, I do bring a lot money, doing work most of my colleagues couldn't do.
The reward structure is proportional to the seniority, so more senior people will get more in absolute numbers.
I don't think money by itself would be a criteria, as I am working for a very profitable company, and they care more about customer satisfaction and quality than short term cost.

sebtomato

Marcon said:

sebtomato said:

Marcon said:

Have you any idea how difficult it is to prove constructive dismissal - or how long it will take to even get a tribunal hearing, because they don't sound as if they are going to roll over any time soon if you do 'go after them' as you put it. Have you actually had any sort of discussion about this apparent change in how 'management' perceives you? Is this one new manager, or a new management team? Is your old manager still around and is there any prospect of changing your line manager? Doing nothing and letting your anxiety and resentment fester won't help, so you need to do something, if only to find out why you have gone from golden boy (or girl) to class dunce in one easy lesson.

Having said all that, it sounds as if your face no longer fits, for whatever reason, and moving on would be the logical thing to do IF you can find a new job and get a reasonable reference from your current employer. 

My company wouldn't go to tribunal and risk any negative publicity, so they would surely settle first. 

In term of reference, large companies only give a factual reference now anyway (basically confirming the role and employment time).

You're making two sweeping statements here, both of which could prove incorrect - the second one certainly isn't accurate. You really can't speak for all large companies just because you work for one of them.

As to negative publicity, there's nothing about a disgruntled employee claiming constructive dismissal on the mundane grounds you've outlined (mundane in the sense it won't hit the headlines, not that it is 'mundane' to you personally), so the company is unlikely to get too bothered about sensational reporting.

Well, in my career, I have worked for quite a few internal large companies (all within the top 10 in the world by market cap).
My current company doesn't give more detailed employment references than just the job title and dates. Many companies do the same name, to avoid liability.
As to negative publicity, I am not talking about the press or hitting the headlines (nobody would care), but more within the industry or colleagues. Large companies are not going to risk some negative reputation just to save a few thousands pounds, particularly when they believe they were possibly partially at fault.

AskAsk

sebtomato said:

AskAsk said:

you can't claim constructive dismissal if you resign as they haven't dismissed you.

Yes you can. Maybe you are confusing it with unfair dismissal...

i see.  here is a link that may help then.
https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/work/leaving-a-job/dismissal/claiming-constructive-dismissal/

sebtomato

eamon said:

Questions

Has your work changed e.g. are you doing different tasks, dropped some tasks?

Is your work measurable?

Is your new manager a newby?

Does your new manager even understand what you do?

Is there a restructure happening?

Do you know more than your new manager?

Marcon is probably correct in that your face no longer fits. If thats the case you can try and make it fit though it probably is time to consider moving on. Don't waste your  time on CD, 99% of the time it goes nowhere and you still loose. If you feel that you have been treated unfairly and contrary to your employers various policies then consider raising a grievance. But I'll caution that with a caveat in that raising a grievance against your line manager rarely ends well. Your colleagues etc if they are even asked to make a statement will rarely do so. Few people like to rock the boat.

No, my work hasn't changed.
Yes, my work is very measurable, in term of revenue, profit and customer satisfaction.
Yes, my manager is a newbie. Probably trying to impose his style.
There is no restructuring happening.
Yes, it's probably that my face no longer fits in that department. Finding a position in another department would be a solution, but I haven't seen any suitable openings so far.
I agree: CD would seem to be a waste of time, and no colleagues are going to take my side against management.

sebtomato

AskAsk said:

sebtomato said:

AskAsk said:

you can't claim constructive dismissal if you resign as they haven't dismissed you.

Yes you can. Maybe you are confusing it with unfair dismissal...

i see.  here is a link that may help then.
https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/work/leaving-a-job/dismissal/claiming-constructive-dismissal/

Thanks? 

Thrugelmir

sebtomato said:

I work for a very large and very profitable company. 

Since lock down begun the world has changed. Even profitable companies have under performing divisions. Local management comes under pressure. Then reverberates down the chain. 

AskAsk

Thrugelmir said:

sebtomato said:

I work for a very large and very profitable company. 

Since lock down begun the world has changed. Even profitable companies have under performing divisions. Local management comes under pressure. Then reverberates down the chain. 

this is very true. 
i think the lockdown has made all companies wary of their future and so everyone is looking at their books and ways of working.  it is a time for everyone to take stock and decide what is best for the company.  to put in contingent plans for the future, where things are uncertain.

sebtomato

Thrugelmir said:

sebtomato said:

I work for a very large and very profitable company. 

Since lock down begun the world has changed. Even profitable companies have under performing divisions. Local management comes under pressure. Then reverberates down the chain. 

Probably applicable to most companies indeed. However, my global company hasn't been affected by the various lockdowns and is still doing extremely well financially. My work hasn't been affected by the lockdown either.