Recently found shares. Who should claim them?

xylophone

Whoops!      

Made me smile!

Shelldean

Manxman_in_exile said:

Depends how far you want to take this, but I'd write back to them one more time and/or make a formal complaint in writing to them.

In the letter (or complaint) I would ask them to explain clearly why they need to see the death certificate of the shareholder's "next of kin".  Point out that the term "next of kin" has no legal significance, and that in any case the shareholder's heir under intestacy rules was his wife, not his son, so that ownership of the shares automatically transferred to her, his widow, on his death.  Now that she has died intestate(?) her heir is xxxx.  The original shareholder's son plays no part whatsoever in the ownership of the shares because he never had any claim to them, and in any case, you do not know his whereabouts or whether he is alive or dead*.  Their request directed to you to provide them with a copy of the son's death certificate is therefore an irrelevant and pointless wild goose chase.

It might be an idea (although I don't know if it's a good one or a bad one!) to say that if they don't co-operate with transfer of the shares to their legal owner, you will seek legal advice.  (They've told you the husband owned the shares - now they are unreasonably preventing transfer of them to their legal owner.)

I can understand the executor wanting to wash their hands of this - but if I were them I'd want to get to the bottom of this and I suppose that strictly speaking, they have a legal duty to get to the bottom of it...

*I suppose the potential downside of this is that the search company now waste more time starting a world-wide search to track down this irrevant nok/son - who my or may not be dead.

EDIT:  The only possible complication is if, with the value of the shares, the husband's estate went over the then intestacy limit for everything to go to his wife  I don't see why the search company simply can't tell the administrator the valus of the shares.

yes the wife did indeed die interstate, her estate passed to three grandchildren. As her only child predeceased her.
The executor likes the quiet life!!! 
I personally would keep going and be a complete dog with a bone till it was resolved, but alas it's not my place I am just the executor secretary (wife! )

I am very tempted to whip up a complaint letter tho. Hadn't thought of THAT path!  I do believe I'll suggest this option to the executor and see what he says. 

Shelldean

Just a thought......

Are the search company not telling us who the shares are held with, because if we knew that, we could and indeed would bypass them and go direct?

poppystar

Shelldean said:

Just a thought......

Are the search company not telling us who the shares are held with, because if we knew that, we could and indeed would bypass them and go direct?

Almost certainly I’d say.

Shelldean

poppystar said:

Shelldean said:

Just a thought......

Are the search company not telling us who the shares are held with, because if we knew that, we could and indeed would bypass them and go direct?

Almost certainly I’d say.

Literally just occurred to me! Sneaky sods!!

Manxman_in_exile

The only way you'll get the shares is by co-operating with them.  (ie paying them a fee!)  I suppose you could try and find out independently, but now that they've contacted your husband and he has replied to them, you'll probably find you have a fight on your hands to get the shares without paying them.  It's one of the reasons I asked earlier what the person who had replied to them had agreed to.

This is why I would argue (if I were the administrator) that they are unreasonably putting barriers in the way of the shares being transferred to their rightful legal owner by asking for a wholly irrelevant (or irrevenant!) document - the son's death certificate.  The son of the original deceased shareholder has no claim to the shares so has no interest whatsoever.  I'd tell them they are acting unreasonably and unlawfully in preventing the correct transfer of the shares. 

You husband really needs to pursue this as he can't justify not doing so without knowing the value of the shares.

And yes - there will inevitably be some finders fee involved for the search company - that's how they make money

xylophone

The only way you'll get the shares is by co-operating with them.  (ie paying them a fee!)  

See https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/77643112/#Comment_77643112

ProSearch have been appointed by the company in which you hold an investment. The company is concerned that you have not received all of the benefits due to you as a result of your investment in their company.

ProSearch charge an administration fee for tracing and re-uniting you with the entitlement due to you. The level of fee has been negotiated by the company in which you held the investment to ensure that it is reasonable and fair to you. Details of the fee to be charged are contained on the claim form. 

It seems likely that the shares in question are in one of the big  PLCs - for example,  see https://investors.nationalgrid.com/shareholder-information/ordinary-shares/asset-reunification

I suppose the OP's husband could check with the likes of  Equiniti,  Link Asset Sevices (formerly Capita), Computershare?

Shelldean

Manxman_in_exile said:

The only way you'll get the shares is by co-operating with them.  (ie paying them a fee!)  I suppose you could try and find out independently, but now that they've contacted your husband and he has replied to them, you'll probably find you have a fight on your hands to get the shares without paying them.  It's one of the reasons I asked earlier what the person who had replied to them had agreed to.

This is why I would argue (if I were the administrator) that they are unreasonably putting barriers in the way of the shares being transferred to their rightful legal owner by asking for a wholly irrelevant (or irrevenant!) document - the son's death certificate.  The son of the original deceased shareholder has no claim to the shares so has no interest whatsoever.  I'd tell them they are acting unreasonably and unlawfully in preventing the correct transfer of the shares. 

You husband really needs to pursue this as he can't justify not doing so without knowing the value of the shares.

And yes - there will inevitably be some finders fee involved for the search company - that's how they make money

that's just the point we have agreed and cooperated all along. Apart from getting and giving them the son's death certificate!!
I don't think the executor has any issue with paying a fee, but we can't get past the son's death certificate request!
Their own website says it's a reasonable fee....But obviously we don't know how they define reasonable.😁😁
Am going to have a chat with hubby and see where we go now!

I only originally asked on here, as while I was reasonably confident that what I said about the way the shares should be transferred. But I wasn't convinced. So wondered what others thought.

And you've just confirmed my thoughta!!!

Edited to add.

Anything that's been sent to them has been sent back! Along with the request for the death certificate. Was a claim from and small estates form. Plus obviously copies of the shareholders death certificate and his wife's plus the grant of probate for the wife.
All have been sent back each time.
Quite well travelled documents!

Shelldean

xylophone said:

The only way you'll get the shares is by co-operating with them.  (ie paying them a fee!)  

See https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/77643112/#Comment_77643112

ProSearch have been appointed by the company in which you hold an investment. The company is concerned that you have not received all of the benefits due to you as a result of your investment in their company.

ProSearch charge an administration fee for tracing and re-uniting you with the entitlement due to you. The level of fee has been negotiated by the company in which you held the investment to ensure that it is reasonable and fair to you. Details of the fee to be charged are contained on the claim form. 

It seems likely that the shares in question are in one of the big  PLCs - for example,  see https://investors.nationalgrid.com/shareholder-information/ordinary-shares/asset-reunification

I suppose the OP's husband could check with the likes of  Equiniti,  Link Asset Sevices (formerly Capita), Computershare?

Will dig out the claim form as they've kindly sent it back and see what it says about feea.
I'll be honest I didn't read it, my husband did!

Manxman_in_exile

Having already replied to Prosearch I think the administrator might be on slightly dodgy ground if they tried a DiY job.  If the shares were suddenly found their rightful home, I think Prosearch might argue it would never have happened but for them contacting the administrator in the first place.  Of course, Prosearch might lose that argument but is it worth the hassle?  (Some people might enjoy the hassle!)