PAC/STAC Code Confusion

iclarke

Hi,

I started a PAYGO Sim with Smarty i April 2019. In July, a better deal came along with the same provider, so I requested to leave without keeping the previous number. I received a "Sorry you're leaving us" email (which stated a STAC code), then I requested a new Sim on the better plan and destroyed my previous Sim. I had not heard of STAC codes before and, to me, they appeared to be interchangeable with PAC - so thought I didn't need to take any further action. One year on, and I discover I have been charged for both Sims (yes, I know I should have kept a closer eye on my bank accounts!)

Smarty have said they will cancel the old Sim and refund my last month's payment. Do I have any rights/leverage to get the rest of my money back? Many thanks.

JJ_Egan

A 'service termination authorisation code' (or STAC code), allows you to cancel your mobile number with your previous supplier when you change networks. - A STAC code is issued free of charge. ... - If you don't use the STAC code, your account will remain open and you'll continue to be charged for service.

iclarke

This sounds like a way of catching folk out. I informed them I wish to terminate the SIM and do not wish to keep the number. Why on earth do I need a code to tell the next provider I want a new number? I'd supply a PAC code if I wanted the same number, the absence of that code should be all that's required for a new number (as it used to be). I was not informed about this new system which, it appears, came in the month before I cancelled (or so I thought) my SIM.

tehone

A STAC code is useful when you're changing providers (but don't care about keeping the number), but don't want to have any gap in service between the two. The new provider arranges everything with your old provider, and on the day of the switch you stop paying the old provider and start paying the new provider, so therefore saving you any overlapping payments. You also don't have to speak to your old provider.

You could still just cancel the contract completely with the old provider, and independently start another contract with a new provider, then its down to you to manage the process and what dates to best choose to minimise downtime / /paying for 2 services etc. This obviously involves you dealing with to sets of providers.

iclarke

Hello, me again.

After a back & forth exchange with Smarty's customer service, their latest reply has taken me by surprise. I'd been arguing that because there was no direct announcement of the new system to their customers (which came in to effect 7 days before I requested my SIM to be cancelled), and nothing on their webpages shown in the process of leaving Smarty to highlight the fact that if you didn't use the PAC/STAC codes, your account would remain active, that I was entitled to a full refund. In response to my latest request for a refund of 12 months of payments, here's their reply:

"Unfortunately we cannot do that, as the auto renew was ON so you should have reconfirmed that when leaving as requesting a PAC/STAC doesn't terminate the account."

So they seem to be saying auto renew was the problem. Am I right in thinking that this is still all about the new system? Having auto renew switched on would not have affected a request to cancel a SIM under the old system, would it? The phraseology in the reply is misleading too. I didn't request a PAC/STAC code. I was given two choices:

"Leave and keep your number"

"Leave without taking your number"

frederick1950

Leave and keep your number ...use a PAC
Leave without number....use a STAC
Did you actually speak to them and request that the contract didnt carry on?
Secondly did you recieve a PAC or STAC ?

iclarke

No, I didn't speak to them. And yes, I received a STAC.

However, 7 days earlier STACs didn't exist, and an online request to cancel a SIM would be honoured without having to reconfirm it by phone.

My argument is that the onus should be on them to fully explain a new system when it's brought in. I'm not being unreasonable, am I?

tehone

iclarke said:

No, I didn't speak to them. And yes, I received a STAC.

However, 7 days earlier STACs didn't exist, and an online request to cancel a SIM would be honoured without having to reconfirm it by phone.

My argument is that the onus should be on them to fully explain a new system when it's brought in. I'm not being unreasonable, am I?

What did they tell you when they gave you the code? It must have been something? Otherwise it woudl be a bit random to give you a code if there as no reason for it.

tehone

In addition, as I have just remembered, Smarty email you every month when they take a payment, so in addition to the payment going out every month, there was an other opportunity to catch the payments earlier.

I do agree that there should be an explanation of how the process works - I'm just not sure yet, that this wasn't explained, even if in a less than useful manner

[Deleted User]

If you didn't use it properly and didn't notice an ongoing payment for 12 months, it's hardly their fault.
If you used it correctly and it didn't work, then it's their fault but why didn't you notice after a few months?

What is the issue here, you didn't use the STAC properly or it didn't work properly?

iclarke

Thanks for your replies. Here is what they told me when they gave me the STAC:

"Hi *******,

You requested to leave without taking your phone number. We hope you enjoyed your time with us and would love to see you back in the future.

Here's your STAC code:

**********

It will expire on 06/08/2019

When you use this code you will lose your credit balance, which is currently £0, and any promotions.

We're really sorry to see you go.

Thanks,

The SMARTY team"

With regards the payment email, I was getting 2 a month, at the same time, on the same day. I should have caught this, but I naively thought it was perhaps a glitch with their email system. The issue (as I see it) is that when a new code and procedure is brought in, it should be announced and explained, leaving no doubt as to how it operates. On their webpages shown during the leaving process, it said you could use PAC/STAC codes by texting them. As I was doing it all via email, I didn't think this applied to me. Also, Smarty can check that there was no activity on this SIM (as I had destroyed it), so they can see my intention was to cancel. It's not as if I'm trying to con them out of anything.