I might get fired for Gross Misconduct and I'm scared what will happen

MoneySeeker1

Adamthom85 said:

Thanks, I'll let you know how my "chat" goes tomorrow. It does seem strange though that they called me on Friday and were a bit vague saying "someone has made an allegation you posted a comment on linkedin which could be deemed racist" which is why I was initially puzzled as I don't use linkedin, I then suggested it may be a Facebook comment to which say said "can you just delete any of the posts" and seemed fairly normal, then just said thank you and "well have another chat on monday"

I can't tell if they have a screenshot, it would explain then being a bit vague about the comment and not immediately doing the investigatory interview right there and then if they had evidence.

Guess I won't know until the chat tomorrow.

I think that was a mistake there to "hand them ammunition" - ie where they said "Linked In" and you then corrected them by suggesting it might have been "Facebook". It would have been better, in the event, to just stick to the absolute basic facts of "No - I didnt say anything on Linked In - as I don't have a Linked-in account". The matter might have ended right there and then - as they wouldnt have been able to say "You said on Linked In...." the second you were able to state you aren't on Linked In.

What you did - or didnt - say on Facebook is a totally different website - and they said nothing about that one.

For future reference - you might be as well to have a totally NON personal Facebook account with a different name to it than the one you are usually known by - and without putting any identifiable photos on it.

Employers are well in the wrong to go spying on employees personal lives like that - but it's something they seem to have been doing for the last few years - wrong as it is and they seem to have got away with it so far without anyone particularly "calling them" on it. Someone will "clock their employer one big time" at some point for spying on them like that - and hopefully there will be a law to stop them doing that sort of thing. I think it best if it isn't you that does that.

Say as little as you possibly can. Volunteer no further information. Keep Facebook as a non-personal thing that you only use for keeping in touch with groups you are interested in - but do not give out personal info. on there again until the day employers can't get away with sacking people because they've spied on them this way (and I admit I have no idea how much longer they'll be able to get away with this before there is a test case and they're clobbered for doing so).

Right now - DO NOT resign. May be they won't decide you are "out the door" - but, if they do, it has to be THEIR doing and not yours. That way - they are the ones that have put themselves in the position that you are no longer working for them - and that should help, I feel, in ensuring they won't be able to manage to reclaim that £12,000 training costs from you. If you are the one that does it (ie you resign) then there is a very good chance they will be after you for repayment of the £12k (because they will say it was your doing you left).

So keep as schtum as possible and do NOT resign.

This is the voice of experience time here - back from before retirement where my employer and I both knew what had happened in my OWN TIME - but I was not going to admit it (because it was my own time - and therefore none of their business).

ScottishGuy1122

Marcon said:

Adamthom85 said:

I have been with them for 2 1/2 years so over the 2 year period. It's a very large company (thousands of employees) which is why I found it strange just a casual mention on Friday and then a casual mention of having another chat by telephone Monday. If it was an investigatory meeting wouldn't they do it over Skype as I can't see any evidence or take notes properly?

HR haven't exactly covered themselves in glory - an inconclusive and under-informed phone call at 5.00 pm on a Friday? Sounds like an ill-judged back covering exercise on their part. Hopefully by tomorrow someone will have thought better of it and be prepared to have a more sensible conversation.

I hope so, I'm scared because my back up for being racially attacked in earlier comments will all be gone as I deleted everything and my profile. So I have only my word that I was provoked and acted stupidly out of character....I'm hoping it wasn't anything that could sound racist as I would never intend that, even though it may be something which could be deemed to be racist.

I'll let you guys know tomorrow what happens.

To be honest, the job, yeah it would totally suck and I've put a lot of effort and sacrafice into....the main reason I'm panicking is because of my mum, we are very very close...she knows everything, even when I moved out at 21 I would pop round 3 times a week and she know everything and I've already screwed up sooo many times with debt, jobs etc and honestly I'm just scared to have her so proud of me and then shatter that again and show how much of a failure I am...that's what I'm more worried about.

MoneySeeker1

Not to mention - for the record - that there are lots of people that are by no stretch of the imagination racists - but, for the last few years they've been at risk of that word being hurled at them by someone who has got it totally wrong (or is after them for some other reason and is looking for some trigger word/any trigger word they can hurl at them). Right at this exact moment too is a really bad time for someone to call someone else a racist unjustifiably - and this may be why this person did so - as the quickest way they could think of to "have a go".

You're not in a race for promotion with a colleague at the moment are you? - and they might be the ones trying this on to clear you out of the way and leave the field open for them to score a win they don't deserve? Worth bearing in mind that sometimes people do use very low tactics to get what they want for themselves - and so it is a possibility to be aware of here.

ScottishGuy1122

MoneySeeker1 said:

Not to mention - for the record - that there are lots of people that are by no stretch of the imagination racists - but, for the last few years they've been at risk of that word being hurled at them by someone who has got it totally wrong (or is after them for some other reason and is looking for some trigger word/any trigger word they can hurl at them). Right at this exact moment too is a really bad time for someone to call someone else a racist unjustifiably - and this may be why this person did so - as the quickest way they could think of to "have a go".

You're not in a race for promotion with a colleague at the moment are you? - and they might be the ones trying this on to clear you out of the way and leave the field open for them to score a win they don't deserve? Worth bearing in mind that sometimes people do use very low tactics to get what they want for themselves - and so it is a possibility to be aware of here.

Hi, no it's definitely not a colleague, I'm not going for promotion at the moment it would definitely be an internet warrior who has baited me (and I fell for it) and have maybe said just enough to be concluded as racist language

Grumpy_chap

Adamthom85 said:

 to which say said "can you just delete any of the posts" and seemed fairly normal, then just said thank you and "well have another chat on monday"

Whatever you said, have you deleted the offending posts now?  Maybe, if they are not there, then the company cannot do anything.  

It is very odd that some member of the public tracked you down to work from a personal FB - you must have really upset them.

And in the future, just stay away from social media as it has got you into too much trouble now twice.

ScottishGuy1122

Grumpy_chap said:

Adamthom85 said:

 to which say said "can you just delete any of the posts" and seemed fairly normal, then just said thank you and "well have another chat on monday"

Whatever you said, have you deleted the offending posts now?  Maybe, if they are not there, then the company cannot do anything.  

It is very odd that some member of the public tracked you down to work from a personal FB - you must have really upset them.

And in the future, just stay away from social media as it has got you into too much trouble now twice.

I deleted everything straight away, so the only proof they have is what's in the email. If they don't have anything I can't see how it's going to progress much more than "be mindful of our social media policy etc" and maybe a warning about future posts.

If they have something on the other hand, they would already know what was said so why wouldn't they do the investigation right there and then. They would obviously know if its grounds for gross misconduct and i woupd be suspended right there and then and told id have an investigation. And why would they think I made the comment on linkedin, when it was face book. The comment threads look different. If they had the post they would know it's facebook. And again, if they already had the information, they surely wouldn't say "thanks, we'll have another chat Monday at some point" they would say "we need to have an investigatory meeting Monday and we will send you a confirmation for a Skype meeting to discuss" or something like that.

Anyway, won't know until tomorrow. Wonder how little sleep I will get tonight

polgara

I’m of the opinion that you shouldn’t say anything on social media that you wouldn’t mind saying to your mother or directly to your boss. That way you can curb the worst ‘retaliation’ responses.  I have taken formal action against staff posting ridiculous statements on social media and I’ve also reported people to their employers.

I have to say the amount of work I get from people posting on social media is astonishing. No matter how many times we remind people of our social media policy people post without thinking of the consequences.

This isn’t the first time around for this poster - really need to grovel and then come off social media until you learn restraint.

MoneySeeker1

I think the poster might just be old enough to remember a time before employers were snooping on social media though.

As an older person myself - I remember the time when we took it for granted that "work is work" and "our own time is our own time" and never the twain shall meet.

So I don't know how long this social media snooping by employers has been going on for? I'd hazard a guess they've been doing it for around 5 years or so - 10 years at the most???

It is difficult to get your  head round why an employer would tell themselves they have the right to do so. I say this as someone that encountered a snooping/condemnatory employer re my own leisure time back before the Facebook era - but we had to give our names we're normally known by etc back in those days.

Hence I'm suggesting to OP to do what they want in their own time (as we all have the right to do) but don't do it under his own name and don't put in photos or other identifiers and be careful who he trusts with that information or turns into a Facebook friend (and certainly not any of his work colleagues). That way they almost certainly would never even know in the first place.

Other thought for OP - try very hard never to get "drawn" by an Internet troll. Goodness knows some of them are very persistent in trying to do so - and I've fallen for it myself before now (but then, I guess, quite a few of us have tried to defend ourselves/hoped to reason with them/etc - before we realise it doesnt work and it's best to try and ignore them).

John_

Adamthom85 said:

Grumpy_chap said:

Adamthom85 said:

 to which say said "can you just delete any of the posts" and seemed fairly normal, then just said thank you and "well have another chat on monday"

Whatever you said, have you deleted the offending posts now?  Maybe, if they are not there, then the company cannot do anything.  

It is very odd that some member of the public tracked you down to work from a personal FB - you must have really upset them.

And in the future, just stay away from social media as it has got you into too much trouble now twice.

I deleted everything straight away, so the only proof they have is what's in the email. If they don't have anything I can't see how it's going to progress much more than "be mindful of our social media policy etc" and maybe a warning about future posts.

If they have something on the other hand, they would already know what was said so why wouldn't they do the investigation right there and then. They would obviously know if its grounds for gross misconduct and i woupd be suspended right there and then and told id have an investigation. And why would they think I made the comment on linkedin, when it was face book. The comment threads look different. If they had the post they would know it's facebook. And again, if they already had the information, they surely wouldn't say "thanks, we'll have another chat Monday at some point" they would say "we need to have an investigatory meeting Monday and we will send you a confirmation for a Skype meeting to discuss" or something like that.

Anyway, won't know until tomorrow. Wonder how little sleep I will get tonight

What will you say if asked about it?

IrishSean

Former employment officer here:
I can't see you having anything to worry about; you haven't defamed your company or been discriminatory in a real or perceived way towards a customer, client, supplier or employee.
There are no 'technical infringements' e.g. personal internet use on work time.
I worked with a girl who had a blog describing how much she hated her job and the company: she couldn't understand why she was told off by management about it! But in the end she wasn't sacked or even disciplined.
In future:
Stay off social media if you plan to give your name.
If accused in the wrong, as in this instance (linked-in, you don't post on it) then say nothing in addition!
Be careful you aren't being baited for a blackmail scam: another reason to staff off social media if you've been singled out and targeted like this; it's unlikely you have, most likely they were a troll with too much time on their hands. 
I think you're over-worrying: in short if they've invested £12k minimum in your training they'll most likely want to support you in avoiding such scrapes in future. They haven't mentioned anything that suggest a disciplinary hearing, which you'd have the right to union representation at at the very least. Most companies deal with pretty baseless complaints like this on a 'rear-guard' basis. 
You'll be fine
Does sound like you'd benefit from help on the debt free wannabe section though. You should post up for advice & support
😀💪