PCN in private carpark at residence NO ticket received on car

freedomfighter82

nosferatu1001 said:

4th time. 
You even quoted. 
Do you have your landlords comms in writing? Yes or No
Have you checked your AST for any rights granted over communal spaces etc?
Does she own the speciifc space? As in, is it an allocated space to her flat and hers alone, demised in her (long) lease?

Apologies if I'm missing your point but thought I'd already responded to this, for clarity all current contact with my landlord has been informal via WhatsApp she NEVER formally (or informally) told me this new parking permit system was in place prior to the ticket being issued. In fact she stated that she only found out about this herself a couple of weeks ago, AFTER I first told her about my ticket. Following this she contacted the 'maintenance company' who informed her it was allegedly brought in the day before I got my ticket.

Double checked my AST below is the only mention of any parking and/or communal spaces as such:
What landlord agrees to do
"Let you have free access to the steps, entrance hall, stairs and all shared areas, if this applies".
What I agree to do

"Park vehicles in your garage (if there is one) or on your parking space only and without causing an

obstruction".

With regards to actually owning an 'allocated space' I'm unsure but they aren't numbered and was never shown an allocated space so I doubt it TBH. Landlord is checking her lease and I'm awaiting a response.

freedomfighter82

*UPDATE*
Below is a response from City Permits Ltd following me emailing them to appeal using the points raised in my initial post/thread:

The management agency X have asked for our services to help monitor this development on the land owners behalf. Due to yourself either renting or leasing you do not legally own the bay outright this bay belongs to the landowner who can set rules and regulations within this development. We have a contract in place, signage around the development which explains clearly the rules and regulations. All permits must be clearly affixed to the front windscreen and fully legible at all times. 

Unfortunately due to this matter being passed to ZZPS due to the time period being over to appeal with City Permits direct we cannot assist you as this ticket will not be cancelled. 

X also provide letters to all residents at the start of this year I believe explaining the rules and regulations, if you have been within the property for 18 months I am more than certain you would have received. I have also been Informed that there should be a clause within your agreement explaining the rules on this area - this has been informed by X, also our signage and contract will stand up legally if this matter moves forward legally therefore we are more than able to ticket anyone in this development. 

Unfortunately there isn’t much more City Permits can do, all I can advise you to do is speak with ZZPS and if you wish to proceed further please ask for a POPLA code which will enable you to appeal further with the independent body. 

I apologise for the lack of help but like stated this ticket will not be cancelled and due to this 

matter no longer being able to be appealed via City Permits we can not do much more. 

Umkomaas

Unfortunately there isn’t much more City Permits can do, all I can advise you to do is speak with ZZPS and if you wish to proceed further please ask for a POPLA code which will enable you to appeal further with the independent body. 

Never phone a debt collector. City Permits are misleading you by suggesting that ZZPS can issue a POPLA code - they cannot and CP know that. Only CP can issue you with a POPLA code. 

EDIT EDIT

It's a bit ambiguous as to who you ask for a POPLA code, so just hold off on the advice below for the moment. Instead, write back to CP and ask them to honour their offer of a POPLA code, let them walk straight into the mantrap when they direct you to ZZPS to obtain it. Then ......

Send an email complaint to Steve Clark of the BPA asking him to investigate this knowingly misleading direction by CP and ask him to intervene by requiring CP to issue you the POPLA code. Ordinarily you're too late to appeal, with then no prospect of a subsequent POPLA appeal, and if CP had simply referred you to ZZPS (with no mention of a POPLA code), there would not be much you could do. But as they've put their foot in their mouth, there's an opening for you. See how you get on with a nice, polite, but firm email to Mr Clark. 'Dear Mr Clark ......', not as someone did a few days ago 'Hi Steve' (no, no, no), some respect towards someone who might be able to help you. 

steve.c@britishparking.co.uk 

nosferatu1001

" or on your parking space only "
So you do have rights, no mention of a permit. 
Point out to your landlord that currently, due to the actions of the MC SHE is in breach of your lease. She NEEDS to get this remedied.
Tell city permits to eff off and to cease and desist. They are trespassing in the space you already have rights over, and interfering with your lease. Regardless of any alleged contract, which was not signed with the landholder but a 3rd party maintenance company with no interest in the land, they are currently committing a tort against you for which you resercve the right to sue them, and their principal, for damages and to obtain an injunction against them .This is their only warning,

D_P_Dance

Yes,  but before I posted the link with the Landlords Forum thread.  Very few people on here are aware of the hoops an  MA should jump through before appointing a PPC.   i

Le_Kirk

D_P_Dance said:

Yes,  but before I posted the link with the Landlords Forum thread.  Very few people on here are aware of the hoops an  MA should jump through before appointing a PPC.  

Agreed, I posted the information (hoops for management companies through which to jump) at 10.45 this morning.

D_P_Dance

It is a pity that so few do.  One of my MCs threatene to impose a scammer.  eighteen monrths ago, I informed them of a/m hoops and they have been silent ever since.  

Coupon-mad

What I agree to do

"Park vehicles in your garage (if there is one) or on your parking space only and without causing an

obstruction".

 Very good, so it does mention your right to park.

Surely the NTK from ZZPS tells you to appeal to ZZPS (as they are doing the back office work for City Permits)?  You only needed to appeal as per the NTK letter, and then get a POPLA code...or am I missing something and the PCN is much older? 

Why appeal to City Permits, surely that's not what the NTK said?

You need to send the ladlord the link I gave you earlier on that tells him/her what the leaseholders must do.  It alredy contained the information needed about the 75%/10% consent rule in the appicable law so you had that already and need to send it to your landlord to read and get in touch with his/her fellow leaseholders to kick City Permits out.  The PA had no right to impose this out of the blue.

Who does the City Permits letter say they 'understand' sent letters out?  Go after that person/company because they didn't, and they can't impose this on the residents.  

But first, do the appeal as per the ZZPS letter, as keeper (not saying who was driving).

D_P_Dance

(not saying who was driving

IMO, in "own space cases" , it is usually more advantageous for the driver to face the PPC in court

Coupon-mad

I agree, but not at POPLA stage, which we are hoping to get the OP to.  At POPLA stage a keeper is best appealing without admitting to driving, because the Assessors are meant to consider the POFA and lack of keeper liability, but won't consider 'own space' arguments.