Defence to letter received from CCBC 09.03.20

Sabs2020

Hi 
I'm just after advise (apologies for using the other thread)
I'm about make first defence letter as I have  now received a letter from County Court Business Centre for PCM charge.

The actual incident happened 15/06/19. The parking company: Parking Control Management UK Ltd. The notice on the letter is for:

"A notice to keeper letter has previously been serve to you. The PCN was issued as the vehicle, with registration mark XXXXX was photographed to be parked in an area managed by Parking Control Management (UK) known as (not sure if I can post name here?) This charge was issued for the following reason - "parked within a restricted area""

The reason why I didn't paid is that I do not agreed with this 'charge' The car was not parked in parking bay, it was left next to building block only because I was helping my parent (who has a disability and was visiting me a time) to get to my back gate of my block so they can access the building. The car then wasn't really "parked" there. Whoever took pictures of the car took them from around 50 meters (not sure if I can include pics here?) possibly observing us getting out of the car and therefore not coming close to make a picture. It was a matter of minutes. No notice was left on my car either. 

My question is would my best way of defence be the one to use the appeal based on the added extra charges or take different appeal with not agreeing with the charge overall base on the facts above (found one on the Newbies post :TEMPLATE ''ONE SIZE FITS ALL'' FIRST APPEAL THAT DOESN'T SAY WHO WAS DRIVING)
and if I should admit to being a driver or not (assuming would not apply to the second option?)

If anyone can help that would be much appreciated 
Many Thanks 
S.
Ps Coupon - Mad - Thank you for advise not sure how to understand 'primacy of contract' the 'land' where the car was left at is next to my block of flat but my block is on different land/address (however the distance between the block is 5 meters, basically a road in between 2 blocks) 

Redx

that date is incorrect

post the ISSUE DATE from the claim form

its too late for any appeal, you are defending a court case, using a DEFENCE

use the recent feb 2020 template by coupon mad for this task

a driver has no protection under POFA

a driver is a witness to what happened on the day

so decide which option is best , keeper and pofa, or driver

if a judge or the claimant asks if you were driving , what would you truthfully say ? think about it

D_P_Dance

The incident happened 15/06/20. 

What in two mionths time, BTW, it is not a fine, it is an invoice from an ex-clamper to compensate them for the alleged harm they suffered when you did what you did. We call it a scam. Pay them not a penny unless a judge so orders it.  Read this,

http://parking-prankster.blogspot.com/2016/11/residential-parking.html

What does your lease/AST say about parking? Does it mention the need to display a permit? If not then it may take primacy over the self serving TnC of the scammer, and interfere with your lawful right to “quiet enjoyment” of your property, possible an offence under The Landlord and Tenants Acts.

Nine times out of ten these tickets are scams, so consider complaining to your MP, it can cause the scammer extra costs and work, and has been known to get the charge cancelled.

Parliament is well aware of the MO of these private parking companies, many of whom are former clampers, and on 15th March 2019 a Bill was enacted to curb the excesses of these shysters. Codes of Practice are being drawn up, an independent appeals service will be set up, and access to the DVLA's date base more rigorously policed, persistent offenders denied access to the DVLA database and unable to operate.

Hopefully, when life gets back to normal, it will become impossible for those scammers who are left to continue their vile trade, but until this is done you should still complain to your MP, citing the new legislation.

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2019/8/contents/enacted

Just as the clampers were finally closed down, so hopefully will many of these Private Parking Companies.

Sabs2020

Redx said:

that date is incorrect

post the ISSUE DATE from the claim form

its too late for any appeal, you are defending a court case, using a DEFENCE

use the recent feb 2020 template by coupon mad for this task

a driver has no protection under POFA

a driver is a witness to what happened on the day

so decide which option is best , keeper and pofa, or driver

if a judge or the claimant asks if you were driving , what would you truthfully say ? think about it

Sorry! The Claim date is 09.03.20. (the June date is the date of the incident) so I think I have 2 weeks to response. (when they saying 'days' do they refer to business days? or any days?)

Can I still use details of my situation i point #16#17(on the defence from coupon-mad link)  but not state who was a driver?

Thanks!

Sabs2020

I tidy the post a bit according to your advise do it is not confusing 

beamerguy

I understand this can be complicated but the dates you give would never induce a county court claim at such short notice ..... the june date is actually when ?

PCM are known scammers UNDER the control of the IPC which is a scam set up by Gladstones solicitots

So, imagine the claim came from the incompetent Gladstones.   Give us a breakdown of the claim

KeithP

With a Claim Issue Date of 9th March, you have until Monday 30th March to file an Acknowledgment of Service, but there is nothing to be gained by delaying it. 

Having filed an AoS, you have until 4pm on Tuesday 14th April 2020 to file your Defence.

That's three weeks away. Plenty of time to produce a Defence, but please don't leave it to the last minute.

To file both an AoS and a Defence, follow the guidance in this post:

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/76880595#Comment_76880595

Guidance on creating a Defence is also in that thread - in the first post on that thread.

Don't miss the deadline for filing an Acknowledgment of Service, nor that for filing a Defence.

Sabs2020

beamerguy said:

I understand this can be complicated but the dates you give would never induce a county court claim at such short notice ..... the june date is actually when ?

PCM are known scammers UNDER the control of the IPC which is a scam set up by Gladstones solicitots

So, imagine the claim came from the incompetent Gladstones.   Give us a breakdown of the claim

The County Court Business Centre CLAIM FORM Issue Date is 09 MAR 2020
The Claimant :
PARKING CONTROL MANAGEMENT(UK) Limited
Address for sending documents: 
GLADSTONE SOLICITORS LIMITED

Particulars of Claim

The driver of vehicle with registration xxxx (the'Vehicle')parked in breach of the term of parking stipulated on the signage (the'Contract') at (name of the place) on 15/06/2019 thus incurring the parking charge (the 'PCN'). The PCN was not paid within 28 days of issue. The Claimant claims the unpaid PCN from the Defendant as the driver/keeper of the vehicle. Despite demands being made, the defendant has failed to settle their outstanding liability. THE CLAIMANT CLAIMS £100 for the PCN, £60 contractual cost pursuant to the Contract and PCN terms and condition, together with statuary interest  of £8.28 pursuant to s69 of the County Courts  Act 1984 at 8% per annum, continuing at £0.04 per day. 

are you saying that if the incident happened in June last year it is very early to receive the court claim already?

Thanks
S.

beamerguy

Sabs2020 said:

beamerguy said:

I understand this can be complicated but the dates you give would never induce a county court claim at such short notice ..... the june date is actually when ?

PCM are known scammers UNDER the control of the IPC which is a scam set up by Gladstones solicitots

So, imagine the claim came from the incompetent Gladstones.   Give us a breakdown of the claim

The County Court Business Centre CLAIM FORM Issue Date is 09 MAR 2020
The Claimant :
PARKING CONTROL MANAGEMENT(UK) Limited
Address for sending documents: 
GLADSTONE SOLICITORS LIMITED

Particulars of Claim

The driver of vehicle with registration xxxx (the'Vehicle')parked in breach of the term of parking stipulated on the signage (the'Contract') at (name of the place) on 15/06/2019 thus incurring the parking charge (the 'PCN'). The PCN was not paid within 28 days of issue. The Claimant claims the unpaid PCN from the Defendant as the driver/keeper of the vehicle. Despite demands being made, the defendant has failed to settle their outstanding liability. THE CLAIMANT CLAIMS £100 for the PCN, £60 contractual cost pursuant to the Contract and PCN terms and condition, together with statuary interest  of £8.28 pursuant to s69 of the County Courts  Act 1984 at 8% per annum, continuing at £0.04 per day. 

are you saying that if the incident happened in June it is very early to receive the court claim already?

Thanks
S.

As per the normal junk from Gladstonea, ILLEGAL RUBBISH
No, I am not saying it's too soon but you have not been helpful to us .... June ? ... 2019. 2018, 2017 WHEN ?

Sabs2020

@beamerguy apologies! just posted June 2020 instead of 2019 by mistake!
This is my first time doing a defence, can I just ask, are the cost much higher than the claim if the judge decided that I need to pay? and if you file a defence but later change your mind, are you still able to go back and pay the claim form? 
Just asking in case this will become over complicated for me! But I defo want to have a go and try to fight them!

Thanks

Redx

you havent given us the total claimed and full costs breakdown, yet you ask for an answer , we can already see they are claiming the spurious abuse of process £60 additional charge for example

here is the typical costs claim for one pcn charge

£100 - original parking charge
£25 - court filing fee
£25 - hearing fee, if it gets that far
£7 or £8 interest.
£50 - solicitor costs for preparing case papers (maximum, capped) - where applicable

So not much more than £200 - IF YOU LOSE!

Anything else they try to add will be spurious and must be challenged with the Judge.

IF YOU WIN - none of the above will be payable by you. But you could claim:

£95 capped maximum for loss of earnings/annual leave for half a day (take pay slips for proof)
Travel costs - public transport or mileage x 45p per mile
Parking costs.

If the PPC has been wholly unreasonable in dealing with the court, then costs awarded against them could be considerably more, but the bar is set very high. We would advise nearer the time if we think this is worth you pursuing.

you can settle out of court anytime you like, but preferably for a lower figure than say £200