Paypal is corrupt!

soolin

biblejohn wrote:

I had a problem with a seller the other week who sold me something blatantly lying abou the item in order to get a higher price for it. I paid via paypal. When the item arrived it was clearly wrong, so i contacted the seller who said "tough". I then raised a dispute via paypal who contacted the seller. I was asking for a refund of the difference in price between what i paid and what the item was really worth. Posting the item back to the seller wasnt an option as it would have cost twice what the item was worth. Paypal contacted the seller who then said "i`ll give a total refund if he sends the item back". I emailed paypal explaining again that this wasnt an option and 3 weeks later ive not heard a think back from them. They have since decided to cancel my dispute.

Bunch of muppets.

So to protect yourself in future you would pay how?

If something is not as described then you have the option of a full refund which it appears you were offered. The refund would have included the original postage paid, but not the amount paid by you to return it, that is exactly what happens online with companies as well. I returned a faulty MP3 player to dabs and not only did they not refund my return postage, they didn't even give me back th epostage i paid in the first place, just the cost of the item.

You don't get the option of a partial refund as something is either what you want, or it isn't.

Soo

biblejohn

soolin wrote:

So to protect yourself in future you would pay how?

If something is not as described then you have the option of a full refund which it appears you were offered. The refund would have included the original postage paid, but not the amount paid by you to return it, that is exactly what happens online with companies as well. I returned a faulty MP3 player to dabs and not only did they not refund my return postage, they didn't even give me back th epostage i paid in the first place, just the cost of the item.

You don't get the option of a partial refund as something is either what you want, or it isn't.

Soo

So you are saying that effectively it is perfectly fine for me (for example) to advertise a 19inch TFT monitor on ebay, have someone pay me 200quid for it, then actually send them a 19inch CRT monitor worth £25 instead????? Then, if the buyer complains tell them they can send it back to me (at their expense), so they will loose £25 postage?

If im buying something which isnt as described, i dont see why i should loose out on the postage.

In my example, the item i bought i paid about 80quid for it, and its only worth £10. Postage is about £25 to return.

So, i have 3 options really.

a) Send the item back and loose £25 through no fault of my own
b) Relist the item on ebay, lying about the item so i hopefully get my cash back from another buyer and rip them off like seller did to me.
c) Relist the item with an accurate, honest description and hopefully get £10->£20 back for my item meaning im only £60 down.

I cant believe ebay or paypal dont offer any kind of protection against ebayers who lie about items in order to sell them. I guess its the risk you take when buying mail order. But at least then you can research the shop and only deal with a reputable shop. It would be nice for ebay or paypal to have a policy where by if the seller lied about the item and it wasnt as descibed then the seller has to pay for the return postage, as its only fair. If the buyer just isnt happy with the item or has changed their mind about the item, then fair enough, they should be liable for the return postage themselves.

"You don't get the option of a partial refund as something is either what you want, or it isn't."

Yes, but in my example, the postage is actually going to cost more than the item is worth, and im being lenient in offering the seller to give me the difference in the value and i will sell the item honestly to recoup the rest of the cash. If happily send the item back to the seller if they refunded me the postage costs.

bleugh

sounds like someone bought a "flat screen monitor"..........

can you show us the item number, we need both sides here as it could clearly be a case of 'tough luck, read the auction description better', or it could be a blatantly lying seller

biblejohn

bleugh wrote:

sounds like someone bought a "flat screen monitor"..........

can you show us the item number, we need both sides here as it could clearly be a case of 'tough luck, read the auction description better', or it could be a blatantly lying seller

I was using the 19inch TFT vs 19inch CRT as an example of a seller lying. Im not stupid enough to buy a "flat screen monitor" assuming it to be a TFT when its a CRT.

In my case the item was described as being a certain size and to double check i specificially asked the seller the items dimentions, he told me, then when it arrived and i measured it it was definately not what he claimed it to be. It was *definately* a case of a lying seller rather than a buyer not reading the auction properly. Using monitors as an example, its like the seller advertising a 19 inch CRT monitor, me getting him to measure the screen to confirm, then him sending me a 15" CRT monitor worth a fraction of the price through the post. Saying "well, the bloke i bought it off told me it was a 19" monitor".

Im just going to have to cut my losses and resell the item hoping to get some of my cash back. Problem now is do i leave the seller negative feedback because they lied about the item, but offered a refund under duress. And then risk them leaving me negative feedback in retailation, even though i paid for their item instantly and accepted the inferior item?

b_hunter_2

as a buyer, using paypal isnt a problem. it's the sellers who suffer when someone scams them via cashback. plus only the seller has to pay fees, not the buyer.

buyer: use paypal, no fees, money sent quickly
seller: fees, 5-7 days to withdraw money, chance of cashback i.e. losing your money AFTER you've sent the item.

danster

hi all,
well well well, i was expecting loads of replies tellin me im being too hard on paypal and ebay. looks like quite the reverse.
bleugh: i like your tip on puuting an anti paypal link on your description (without the dots).
biblejohn: whole heartedly sympathise. you are experiencing exactly the same as i am at the moment. get in touch with your credit card company and hopefully they will reclaim your money. if you can prove that you wanted to return the item (via the emails youve sent to the seller), then your credit card company will make the seller pay for return postage. thsi si something that i asked my credit card company about (lloyds tsb)
b_hunter: as a buyer, using paypal is a massive problem (also as a seller!). yes, there arent fees (although i see sellers who say they'll add 5% to price if buyer uses paypal), money is sent quickly and its fairly easy to set up (although paypals site is utter garbage from a usability point of view . im a web designer so i speak with some authority on this). BUT if the seller stitches you, then paypal are utter useless. i thought that paypal protects against fraudsters, which is the whole point of using paypal in teh first place, but have since found them to be as scheming as the fraudsters.

soolin

Sellers are not allowed to charge extra for using paypal, is you see a seller saying that then they should be reported to ebay.

I'm sorry you have had problems with paypal, I've always found them OK and have never had problems.

I also would really not suggest that people put the 'anti paypal' web links in their auctions. Most of those websites are full of misinformation and people whinging because they never read the terms and conditions when they signed up. It looks rather amateurish to link to them. If you don't like paypal then fine, use something else. I'm more than happy to see a seller that doesn't take paypal, as long as that seller is happy to forgo my bid.

Soo

heathen

these paypal threads are always the same

in the paypal corner,anyone who has never had a problem with them and enjoys the convenience and security it provides.

in the i hate paypal corner anyone whos had a problem with them which they failed to solve(or didnt even try)

personaly i havnt had a problem with them(apart from the extortionate fees)but i hear lots of stories about their poor service that i think they could do with getting their act together,they have a virtual monopoly on e-bay so i guess they think they can do what they like.

ian

Phonix

the paypal corner,anyone who has never had a problem with them and enjoys the convenience and security it provides.
/quote]

but they don't provide security and that's the point.

Their payment protection is useless.

biblejohn

Phonix wrote:

the paypal corner,anyone who has never had a problem with them and enjoys the convenience and security it provides.
/quote]

but they don't provide security and that's the point.

Their payment protection is useless.

Precisely. To be honest, most people havent got a choice over whether or not they use paypal. Buyers do like paying instantly and those sellers offering paypal are more likely to get a sale.

I still use paypal for buying & selling, and have only had this one problem where ive needed to test their customer services. Unfortunately im still waiting for a reply to the email i sent them 4 weeks back.