UKCPM Claim form recieved, Poor Signage

TiredJockey

Hi there, 
Mid last year my vehicle recieved a PCN from UKPCM for parking without a permit. The carpark in question has a very poor principle sign placed litterally at ground level which the driver did not see when entering the carpark, as it can't be seen from your vehicle. On top of this the signage inside the carpark is placed behind bays and can be, as it was in the drivers case, blocked from view by any large parked vehicles. The signs are only approximately 50cm tall to start with so they're easy to miss with tiny font. 

• I have photographs showing the poor signage. Is this enough to base a defence on? 
• Last week I recieved the claim form (attached below) from the county court business center with an issue date of 12 Feb. I have read the newbie thread and sent a SAR but am niave to the process, should I file the acknowledgement of service immediately?
• The most relevant defence example I could find is this one is this a good place to start?  https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/74674865#Comment_74674865
  

Any advice or examples of defences in this scenario you could help me with in regards to this would be much appreciated.

KeithP

With a Claim Issue Date of 12th February, you have until Monday 2nd March to file an Acknowledgement of Service, but there is nothing to be gained by delaying it. To file an AoS, follow the guidance offered in a Dropbox file linked from post #2 of the NEWBIES FAQ sticky thread - https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/4816822/newbies-private-parking-ticket-old-or-new-read-these-faqs-first-thankyou 

About ten minutes work - no thinking required.

Having filed an AoS, you have until 4pm on Monday 16th March 2020 to file your Defence.

That's nearly four weeks away. Plenty of time to produce a Defence, but please don't leave it to the last minute.

When you are happy with the content, your Defence could be filed via email as suggested here:

1. Print your Defence.
   
2. Sign it and date it.
   
3. Scan the signed document back in and save it as a pdf.
   
4. Send that pdf as an email attachment to CCBCAQ@Justice.gov.uk
5. Just put the claim number and the word Defence in the email title, and in the body of the email something like 'Please find my Defence attached'.
   
6. No need to do anything on MCOL, but do check it after a few days to see if the Claim is marked "defence received". If not, chase the CCBC until it is.
   
   After filing your Defence, there is more to do...
   
   
7. Do not be surprised to receive an early copy of the Claimant's Directions Questionnaire. Nothing of interest there. Just file it.
   
8. Wait for your own Directions Questionnaire from the CCBC, or download one from the internet - https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/form-n180-directions-questionnaire-small-claims-track , and then complete it as described by bargepole in his 'what happens when' post linked from post #2 of the NEWBIES thread - https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/4816822/newbies-private-parking-ticket-old-or-new-read-these-faqs-first-thankyou"]
   
9. The completed DQ should be returned by email to the CCBC to the same address and in the same way as your Defence was filed earlier.
   
10. Send a copy of your completed DQ to the Claimant - to their address on your Claim Form.

Fruitcake

If you haven't told the scammers who was driving then you should edit your post to remove information about who did what. Only ever refer to The Driver and The Keeper, who are two different people.

What happened when you complained to the landowner?

Have you complained to your MP yet about this unregulated scam?

D_P_Dance

They are claiming for unlawful amounts, read this

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6014081/abuse-of-process-district-judge-tells-bwlegal

and report Gladstones to the SRA for abuse of process

https://www.sra.org.uk/

Nine times out of ten these tickets are scams, so consider complaining to your MP, it can cause the scammer extra costs and work, and has been known to get the charge cancelled.

Parliament is well aware of the MO of these private parking companies, many of whom are former clampers, and on 15th March 2019 a Bill was enacted to curb the excesses of these shysters. Codes of Practice are being drawn up, an independent appeals service will be set up, and access to the DVLA's date base more rigorously policed, persistent offenders denied access to the DVLA database and unable to operate.

Hopefully life will become impossible for the worst of these scammers, but until this is done you should still complain to your MP, citing the new legislation.

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2019/8/contents/enacted

Just as the clampers were finally closed down, so hopefully will many of these Private Parking Companies.

TiredJockey

Skype hearing for this schedueled this week, have yet to have any correspondance from Gladstones regarding this though, assume they're supposed to send me something they intend to rely on before hand?

Also had nothing from the court telling me how to join this skype hearing so am a bit puzzled at the moment, there was nothing in the last correspondance I had from the court saying I had to arrange anything else. 

Anyone have any ideas? 

Redx

Both you and the claimant have the same deadlines to exchange witness statements plus Exhibits etc , your court order should state that deadline , maybe on the back ?

Due to telephone hearings the court tells both parties what to do about it , see the telephone hearings thread by coupon mad

I suggest you check your paperwork again , today , if in doubt ring the court tomorrow

Fruitcake

What did you put in your defence?
Have you submitted your WS yet?
As Redx has said above, the court should have told you exactly what to do and by when. 
You need to ring the court tomorrow and find out exactly what's going on, and make sure you don't sleepwalk into a default CCJ.

Coupon-mad

Sounds like you may not have submitted a WS and evidence either...hope you did but please confirm that you are also not in breach of the Order?

Hopefully, Gs have discontinued which would explain why you haven't had info about how to attend the Skype hearing, but you must ring the local court and ask.

TiredJockey

Defence was based on an explanation of poor signage at the site, referring to the IPC code of practire and the attempt at double recovery. Not going to go into detail on it I am confident that the defence makes sense at least. 

I have submitted a witness statement although was a little late with it unfortunately, if it comes down to that its on me, had some distracting personal circumstances and not had correspondance from court or gladstones since last summer to remind me. Would a late WS affect them corresponding with me further? Thought I'd still get invited to the hearing after all they should have my email from the DQ.  

I'll call up the court and find out tomorrow then, assuming thats the local one its assinged to? 

Redx

If you nominated your local court , it's that one , so you need to find the missing order , which may have gone into your spam box , but I would expect it would come by letter

The court order telling you about witness statement plus exhibits deadlines should have been from your local court , no need to guess , it's the only court involved !!

MCOL ( the CCBC ) hasn't had any involvement since you submitted your DQ last year

In any case , it's important you check the score tomorrow , because you should already know and it's very late in the day

nosferatu1001

1) Why did you expect a "reminder"? Courts order, they dont remind! This isnt primary school, but a courts process. 
2) What was your deadline?
3) Get out the letter telling you it was a Telephone hearing. READ IT and tell US what it says about how to make contact.