Junctions & mobile phones.

JustAnotherSaver

I get used to having an opinion in the minority on here so i'm curious to see the views of people on the other side of the fence as to why this is ok.


When i was brought up (pre-mobile phone glued to hand era) i was always taught that when you're about to cross the road you chuffin well look around you!! If it looks like a car is about to cross your path then you don't move. You don't cross just because you feel you're the most important person in the world and everyone should wait for you, you wait.


FFWD to the present day and i see so many people, head down, right in the mouth of the junction, not even looking, face directed towards their phone & they just walk. Then they crap themselves when a car starts turning in.

Now surely even the most stubborn of MSE'ers would have to agree with me on that one that the pedestrian is at fault.


I've had a few though, obviously one being this morning which sparks this thread, where they just start shouting nonsense at me because apparently i'm in the wrong.
Take this morning as an example ... I come to a stop probably about the same time a pedestrian comes to a stop wanting to cross the junction i'm about to turn in to. She'll be crossing the lane i'm going in to first. There's only 1 car holding me up, once that passes (which really isn't far away) i can go. The woman decides to cross and is about to set foot in to the next lane as the car passes me, so i turn in. I'm in my lane, the pedestrian is now in the next lane, but i suppose a vehicle being there has upset her dearly because she's now shouting abuse at me.


Maybe i should've waited for her to complete her journey, wherever the destination may have been.




And that's another point - chuffin dawdlers.

Again, back when i was a kid, i'd get a clip round the ear if i didn't pick my feet up.
A few months ago i'm approaching a junction and just as i'm about to get to the very end of it this guy walks out, slow as you like in front of me. No rush no nothing. Just trundling along, head in his phone. If it was the other way about, for me i was too close to the junction to even try step out on the road. I'd have waited or walked behind the car. This time i beeped the guy who started shouting that he has right of way because he's a pedestrian.


Now if these were 10-15 year old scrotes i could understand, as they walk around with a you can't touch me swagger, but both of these people were probably uni students, or of the late teen / early 20 age.


So am i wrong then? Pedestrians can basically do as they please?


Anyone else reading this seeing an increase in this do what i want attitude?
And was i the only one clipped for not crossing a road quick enough? :rotfl:

AdrianC

JustAnotherSaver wrote: »

Now surely even the most stubborn of MSE'ers would have to agree with me on that one that the pedestrian is at fault.

Highway Code rule 7.

I've had a few though, obviously one being this morning which sparks this thread, where they just start shouting nonsense at me because apparently i'm in the wrong.
Take this morning as an example ... I come to a stop probably about the same time a pedestrian comes to a stop wanting to cross the junction i'm about to turn in to. She'll be crossing the lane i'm going in to first. There's only 1 car holding me up, once that passes (which really isn't far away) i can go. The woman decides to cross and is about to set foot in to the next lane as the car passes me, so i turn in. I'm in my lane, the pedestrian is now in the next lane, but i suppose a vehicle being there has upset her dearly because she's now shouting abuse at me.

So a multi-lane road, and you moved off as soon as the crossing pedestrian was clear of directly blocking your car?

Mmm... What happened to HC147?

A few months ago i'm approaching a junction and just as i'm about to get to the very end of it this guy walks out... in front of me.

His priority. HC 170.

This time i beeped the guy

Mmm... 147 again?

Anyone else reading this seeing an increase in this do what i want attitude?

Along with an "I know my rights, I'm in the right, so sod you!" attitude.

Not just from pedestrians, it seems.

If you're harking back to your childhood, perhaps you can remember what your mother told you about the exchange rate between wrongs and rights?

facade

JustAnotherSaver wrote: »

FFWD to the present day and i see so many people, head down, right in the mouth of the junction, not even looking, face directed towards their phone & they just walk. Then they crap themselves when a car starts turning in.

Now surely even the most stubborn of MSE'ers would have to agree with me on that one that the pedestrian is at fault.

I suspect that the Police would take a different view when they prosecute for causing injury/death by careless driving.


Highway code rule 170

Take extra care at junctions. You should

• watch out for pedestrians crossing a road into which you are turning. If they have started to cross they have priority, so give way

It is only a "should" so I would have thought careless would definitely stick, especially given that even the stupidest driver can predict that they are going to carry on across the junction, never mind the mythical "careful & competent driver".

JustAnotherSaver

AdrianC wrote: »

Mmm... What happened to HC147?

What happened to it? I looked that up & fail to see your point.



I didn't throw anything out of the vehicle
I didn't engage in any verbal with them
I was patient - they had crossed and was in the next lane. I also let the car coming my way go by instead of rushing to turn in front of it.
I didn't allow myself to become agitated (unlike the pedestrian). I did pull over as i went & parked outside my house.
I didn't drive close to anyone and in this occasion nobody pulled directly in front of me. I was confused as to this persons issue.


But i see what you're doing

JustAnotherSaver

facade wrote: »

I suspect that the Police would take a different view when they prosecute for causing injury/death by careless driving.

I'd have to be pretty good to cause injury/death when someone is in a different lane to me. Surely part of causing injury/death means i'd have to come in to contact with them?






Ok this whole...

if they have started to cross they have priority

You're coming to a junction. There is a pedestrian on your left, so you're in the lane that they would immediately step in to.


Just as you're a half car from the junction or even less, they decide they have more rights than you as they're a pedestrian so they step out in front.


They immediately have priority right? They're stupid, but immediately have priority because they started to cross?


So i could go step out on to the road with cars doing silly speeds & they'll have to slam on & stop for me, because i'll have started to cross & i'll have priority?


Obviously i'm taking it to the extreme to make a point but you get the point surely.

AdrianC

JustAnotherSaver wrote: »

What happened to it? I looked that up & fail to see your point.

Yes, I thought you might.

I was patient - they had crossed and was in the next lane. I also let the car coming my way go by instead of rushing to turn in front of it.

Odd definition of "patient", moving off as soon as they're out of your way while still between your lane and the one next to you.

I didn't drive close to anyone

Don't you regard pedestrians as "road users"? Or, indeed, people?

But i see what you're doing

Good-oh. Will you take account of it next time?

Oh, and since you only partially precised the exact wording (accidentally, I'm sure, especially insofar as the first two words are concerned...), let me just remind you of the full wording, with their emphasis...

The_Highway_Code wrote:

147
Be considerate. Be careful of and considerate towards all types of road users, especially those requiring extra care (see Rule 204).

* you MUST NOT throw anything out of a vehicle; for example, food or food packaging, cigarette ends, cans, paper or carrier bags. This can endanger other road users, particularly motorcyclists and cyclists.
* try to be understanding if other road users cause problems; they may be inexperienced or not know the area well.
* be patient; remember that anyone can make a mistake.
* do not allow yourself to become agitated or involved if someone is behaving badly on the road. This will only make the situation worse. Pull over, calm down and, when you feel relaxed, continue your journey.
* slow down and hold back if a road user pulls out into your path at a junction. Allow them to get clear. Do not over-react by driving too close behind to intimidate them.

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/the-highway-code/general-rules-techniques-and-advice-for-all-drivers-and-riders-103-to-158

facade

JustAnotherSaver wrote: »

You're coming to a junction. There is a pedestrian on your left, so you're in the lane that they would immediately step in to.


Just as you're a half car from the junction or even less, they decide they have more rights than you as they're a pedestrian so they step out in front.


They immediately have priority right? They're stupid, but immediately have priority because they started to cross?


So i could go step out on to the road with cars doing silly speeds & they'll have to slam on & stop for me, because i'll have started to cross & i'll have priority?

If you are talking about in the junction after you turn off- yes they have priority, no you can't run them over, and if you saw them approaching, and knew there would likely be a conflict, it is your fault entirely.


If you mean someone steps into the main road in front of you just before you get to the junction, then no, they don't have priority, and you can just run them straight over. You would then have to stop to get their details so that you can bill them for any damage to the car, so it is probably easier to just let them go across

JustAnotherSaver

I was thinking about making a thread saying how i think it's dark around 10pm at night & watch how many people here disagree with it.


My guess is the majority. And certainly 100% of 'the usuals'.

facade wrote: »

no you can't run them over,

Didn't say i thought i could

and if you saw them approaching, and knew there would likely be a conflict,

I didn't at all. They were in the next lane.
It's not like when i create a thread & i know there's going to be conflict originating from 'the usuals'. This person had passed, so when they spun & started shouting i was surprised.



It's like those people on local Facebook groups who go on to have a rant starting with "to the person that...". Well if it bothered you so much why not say at the time? The person likely has no idea anything has bothered you.


Now if i had started to turn while the person was in my lane & i'd almost hit them ... i could understand.

IntotheAbyss

I know that pedestrians have right of way if they are already in the road, which makes sense since you are in a vehicle which could cause injury or death should you hit them.

What annoys me though, is like you say, that some people don't even look. Or the ones that do look but just saunter across anyway while walking with a "tough guy" attitude. There's a lot of these round my way, chavs who don't give a toss and would give you the finger if you tooted the horn at them.

Just this morning on my drive to work, I was on a road that is a two lane dual carriageway, that becomes a 4 lane junction. A lane to turn left, a lane to go straight on, bus lane to go straight on and a lane to turn right. In that order, left to right.

I was in the lane to turn right and traffic is now moving. I'm nearing the turning point when I notice there's a guy just standing in the middle of the bus lane. He must have started crossing (left to right) when the lights were red and they changed to green in the middle of his crossing so now he was contending with moving cars and decided to just stop in the bus lane. I know he now has right of way as he's in the road already but it was dark and raining and he was in dark clothing that he was hard to notice until I was already beside him. I assume for the others drivers too as no one stopped for him.
The galling thing is there is a pedestrian crossing not 10 feet from where he was, but he couldn't be bothered to walk that far.

Had another guy in the middle of the road, I stopped to let him finish crossing and he just waves me on. No, you're in the middle of the road, you finish crossing and we can all be on our way. Another one where an actual pedestrian crossing was only a few feet away.

It really annoys me as I was taught not to be an idiot and only cross if the road was clear.

facade

JustAnotherSaver wrote: »

Now if i had started to turn while the person was in my lane & i'd almost hit them ... i could understand.

The bit either I or you don't understand is


Could you tell that they were going to cross into your lane? If there is no physical divider (island/refuge), then 1, 2, 3, 4 lanes still count as the junction, and pedestrians have priority when you are turning in.


You description reads as if you zoomed past her 6 feet in front of her because you knew that the back of your car will clear her path before her feet reached yours.





If you are confident that you missed her by miles, and she didn't need to slow, stop or jump back, then stop worrying about it.

Car_54

IntotheAbyss wrote: »

I know that pedestrians have right of way if they are already in the road, which makes sense since you are in a vehicle which could cause injury or death should you hit them.

What annoys me though, is like you say, that some people don't even look. Or the ones that do look but just saunter across anyway while walking with a "tough guy" attitude. There's a lot of these round my way, chavs who don't give a toss and would give you the finger if you tooted the horn at them.

Just this morning on my drive to work, I was on a road that is a two lane dual carriageway, that becomes a 4 lane junction. A lane to turn left, a lane to go straight on, bus lane to go straight on and a lane to turn right. In that order, left to right.

I was in the lane to turn right and traffic is now moving. I'm nearing the turning point when I notice there's a guy just standing in the middle of the bus lane. He must have started crossing (left to right) when the lights were red and they changed to green in the middle of his crossing so now he was contending with moving cars and decided to just stop in the bus lane. I know he now has right of way as he's in the road already but it was dark and raining and he was in dark clothing that he was hard to notice until I was already beside him. I assume for the others drivers too as no one stopped for him.
The galling thing is there is a pedestrian crossing not 10 feet from where he was, but he couldn't be bothered to walk that far.

Had another guy in the middle of the road, I stopped to let him finish crossing and he just waves me on. No, you're in the middle of the road, you finish crossing and we can all be on our way. Another one where an actual pedestrian crossing was only a few feet away.

It really annoys me as I was taught not to be an idiot and only cross if the road was clear.

The HC says pedestrians have priority when "crossing a road into which you are turning", not in the situation you describe.