Neighbour and management threatening fines and eviction

Annastin

At least once a week since we moved in a few months ago. The last instance was yesterday to inform us that they have complained to management and that it could result in a fine and eviction if we didn't bring the noise down.

sal_III

Annastin wrote: »

Thanks for all your responses, that is a relief! Except for the downstairs neighbours, we really like everything else about the flat so happy to hear that we should be able to continue as is until the end of our AST at least.

I'll wait for my partner to come home this evening and then go downstairs and tell them clearly that this is the most we can do and that they are free to take whatever action they think appropriate but to stop knocking on our door and bothering us.

I wouldn't bother going downstairs. Just wait for them to come and complain the next time, then politely explain that you have taken such and such measures, which is all you can do on your end. If they have a problem with that - take it up with the LL.

Also politely inform them that you are fully aware they can't impose/enforce any fines or evictions on you, so to stop with the empty threats.

The most they can do is complain to the council that might come and install some noise recording equipment in the neighbours flat, which will record normal everyday life noise and their complaint will be dismissed.

phill99

The only organisation in the country with the power to impose fines is the judiciary (and in some cases, the Police).


Therefore they cannot fine you.


In terms of your noise, it sounds like your noise is consistent with that of a normal family. Children play, laugh, cry etc.


Your neighbours are within their rights to seek advice from Environmental Health at your local authority. But they are likely to say, even after visiting their property and even putting in noise detection equipment that the noises you generate are not classed as noise pollution and are to be expected to in a flat that has little or no sound insulation.


The problem is evidently theirs, and not yours. I'm assuming that come 8.00pm your children are in bed and not running round the house. So there is no unreasonable noise at night.


If they knock again, encourage them to go to the Council Environmental Health department who will put tem in their place. Also remind them that neither they nor the managing agents do not have the power to fine you or evict you.

davidmcn

Annastin wrote: »

The Tenant will not make any noise that is audible outside the Property from 11pm to 7am daily.

Apart from anything else, it depends how good the sound insulation is. I've lived in a flat where you could hear the toilet upstairs being used (and I don't just mean when they flushed it!). Pretty normal for activities in neighbouring flats to be "audible" - doesn't mean they constitute a nuisance by any objective standard.

AdrianC

Let's just assume for a moment that the noise you are making really is above and beyond acceptable normal levels. Whether it is or not, we don't know. But let's briefly assume, and look at what options really would be available.

The council would be the most effective recipient of the neighbour's complaints. The council may be able to issue a penalty against you.

The management company and/or freeholder can certainly pass any complaints on to your landlord, the leaseholder, if your flat is in breach of the lease - whether you are aware of that breach or not. But they cannot terminate your tenancy or fine you. It would have to be an egregious breach for them to be able to even credibly threaten the lease.

Your landlord can give you s21 notice after your fixed tenancy period is up, or s8 notice immediately. Grounds 12 (breach of tenancy) and 14 (anti-social behaviour) would be the most appropriate - but he would have to prove in court that there were genuine breaches, since they're not mandatory grounds.

Right, assumption over. Of course, you may also have grounds to complain about your neighbour harrassing you, especially if the noise is not excessive...

Annastin

Our landlord is entirely unbothered by the whole saga and unless his hand is forced, I think it very unlikely that he will try to evict us. But, we'll cross that bridge when we come to it.

I do wish they went to the council/management/etc and left us alone!

RelievedSheff

Annastin wrote: »

Our landlord is entirely unbothered by the whole saga and unless his hand is forced, I think it very unlikely that he will try to evict us. But, we'll cross that bridge when we come to it.

Your landlord won't be bothered he is collecting the rent money and doesn't have to put up with noise from the neighbours!

I do have some sympathy for your neighbours as we had to live with the noise from our neighbours and their children and it is one of the most annoying situations to live with and can leave you at your wits end.

I would try and sort this problem out amicably with your neighbours as left unchecked these situations can become bitter and nasty. Try and come to some sort of agreement with them as to what is and isn't acceptable noise at what times. As much as you might think the noise you are generating is just normal family noise if it is impacting the lives of those living around you then some changes have to be made. Your own life choices should not have an adverse effect of those living around you, which works both ways of course.

gomer

Just sit tight & wait for them to knock again. When they do tell them if they knock any more you will report them to the management company for harassment.

Annastin

What is unacceptable to them is the noise of my children crying and the noise of us walking around. As I mentioned, I already have a high pile rug in the living room which is where the kids play. My partner and I use soft slippers. For obvious reasons, my kids walk around barefoot or in socks.

With all due respect, what more do you suggest I do to reduce these two sources of noise?

RelievedSheff wrote: »

Try and come to some sort of agreement with them as to what is and isn't acceptable noise at what times. As much as you might think the noise you are generating is just normal family noise if it is impacting the lives of those living around you then some changes have to be made.

gomer

I've quoted my own post from the thread about laminate flooring as it may have some similarities (or not)

gomer wrote: »

I have lived with really noisy people below me but have also been on the other side of this argument before.

When i first moved into my new flat, within a couple of weeks i started being harassed by a downstairs neighbour who kept knocking on my door trying to bully me into tip toeing around in my new home & complaining about every tiny little sound. It got to a point that i couldn't even walk from one side of the room to the other without him shouting abuse up at me.

I even wondered if perhaps i was making a lot of noise but just wasn't aware of it He became so obsessed with his bullying campaign that he then reported me to the council for antisocial behaviour & influenced other residents to complain about me as well.

The outcome was that he ended up being evicted himself after causing months of harassment & antisocial behaviour of his own with his unreasonable complaints & nuisance behaviour. It was proven with recording equipment that nothing other than normal everyday household sounds was being made & that my neighbour was being completely unreasonable and causing harassment.

What i am trying to say is are you absolutely sure you are not focusing too much on every little sound because you had issues with previous neighbours? I genuinely really was not causing or even trying to cause any unreasonable noise in my flat & was vindicated with recording equipment, but the man below me described normal household movement and sounds in a similar way to yourself - that it was constant & keeping him awake.

If indeed your perception of the noise is worse than the actual noise itself then perhaps living in such close proximity to other people is not for you & maybe you need to think about moving.