Vcs ema petrol station yet again!

Loretta1970

Post #1


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Posts: 4
Many thanks to anyone who can get me out of this situation. Heres the dilemma, earlier on this year me and my friend dropped off two friends at east midlands airport garage, there was a large traffic jam heading for the fast drop off so we nipped into the onsite garage and pulled up to the left hand side of the garage (well away from the pumps) and literally was there for 60 seconds. Fast forward a week or two and i got a parking charge notice from vcs in sheffield. Googled them and the advice read online was to simply ignore all correspondence (i know my mistake) ive hid all the threats of ccj court etc from the hubby but today i received a letter from northampton county court. Never been in trouble in my life and am worried sick. Dare not tell the hubby as he will go stir crazy so im going to have try sort it on my own.
The particulars of claim are as follows:

The claim is for breach of contract for breaching the terms and conditions set on private land. The defendants vehicle •••••• was identified in the east midlands airport on the 02/07/19 in breach of the advertised terms and conditions, namely stopping in a zone where stopping is prohibited. At all material times the defendant was the registered keeper and/or driver. The terms and conditions upon entering private land were clearly displayed at the entrance and in prominent locations.
The sign was the offer and act of entering private land and was the acceptance of the offer hereby entering into contract by conduct.The signs specifically detail the terms and conditions and the consequences of failure to comply, namely a parking charge notice will be issued, and the defendant has failed to settle the outstanding liability.
The claimant seeks the recovery of the parking charge notice, contractual costs and interest.

Not sure if this is the right thing to put in my defence box but here roughly goes:
the vehicle in the photos was down the side of the garage so when entering the garage it would have been impossible the conditions have been read and agreed within a moving car.
Im also pretty sure i didnt receive the charge within the 14 days but cant be 100%on that but it was deffo close.
The charge also refers to the keeper (me) and not the driver at the time of alleged offence (not me).
I need to word it correctly obviously before i post it back but can any kind person advise me further as to what else i can put forward in for my defence? i really at at a loss because i dont understand how and what to say in my defence
I have filled the online form (aos?) and have now got some extra time to submit a defence.
Many many thanks to anyone who can help. Loretta

Coupon-mad

Don't put anything in the defence box! NOT 'TBA' and not even a full stop.

You will not being filling in paperwork, you will be doing a decent PDF defence document like all the others on here, but the first thing is to:

(a) tell your husband. You are not in trouble and these scam claims are easy enough to deal with and see off
(b) do the AOS online as shown in pictures in the NEWBIES thread
(c) tell us the issue date of the N1 claim?
(d) send the parking firm a SAR by email to their data privacy email address.

Half_way

Are they using the protection of freedoms act?

East Midlands airport, is covered by by-laws including the petrol station ( which at one time in the distant past used to be competitively priced, and was a regular stop for me to pick up sandwiches etc)


East midlands Airport Byelaws here:
https://live-webadmin-media.s3.amazonaws.com/media/7234/east-midlands-airport-byelaws-2001-re-issued-september-2009.pdf


Taken from here: https://www.eastmidlandsairport.com/about-us/operational-documents/


Also of use is this wordy document, in particular page 91"Appendix 2 - EMA Boundary and Land Ownership" https://live-webadmin-media.s3.amazonaws.com/media/6998/aerodrome-manual-2019-v20.pdf

Loretta1970

I will try to tell him today but its really awkward as we recently moved and could really do without paying these vultures.
I have filled in the aos and got an email back yo confirm this
The date on the n1 was the 11.11.19
I had a look at the link regarding pofa, it may sound dumb to those on the know but i dont know what i am looking for on the map as well as dont understand bylaws etc
I am really struggling here with all this and doubt is creeping into my mind, think im going to have to cough up when it goes to court.
Please please help!��

The_Deep

The signs specifically detail the terms and conditions and the consequences of failure to comply, namely a parking charge notice

How specifically detailed? Signs can cntain too much detail, read this.

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]PE signs leave much to be desired. Many judges might find them insufficiently clear to form a contract, read this;[/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/5972164/parking-eye-signs-oxford-road-reading[/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]If this goes to court emphasize this in your defence, here is a successful recent court case.[/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/5957364/first-parking-eye-appeal-unsuccessful[/FONT]

Fruitcake

The_Deep wrote: »

The signs specifically detail the terms and conditions and the consequences of failure to comply, namely a parking charge notice

How specifically detailed? Signs can cntain too much detail, read this.

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]PE signs leave much to be desired. Many judges might find them insufficiently clear to form a contract, read this;[/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/5972164/parking-eye-signs-oxford-road-reading[/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]If this goes to court emphasize this in your defence, here is a successful recent court case.[/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/5957364/first-parking-eye-appeal-unsuccessful[/FONT]

What have Parking Lie got to do with a VCS PCN at an airport?

Umkomaas

Fruitcake wrote: »

What have Parking Lie got to do with a VCS PCN at an airport?

Jeez, what has he been on - random firing of the Gatling Gun all over the place this morning with irrelevant red herring copy and pastes! :rotfl:

Half_way

Under no circumstances should you name the driver.
I can remember something about contesting jurisdiction being involved in cases such as this, where if the land/area is covered by by-laws then it is not within the remit of the county court ( small claims track) to deal with - hopefully someone will be along to add/correct the above



this was a post from Coupon mad in another thread on the same subject, see here

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6036844/vcs-parking-charge-east-midlands-airport&highlight=contest+jurisdiction

If this is VCS at an Airport then read tons of VCS Airport threads to learn how important it is to know to CONTEST JURISDICTION and NOT acknowledge the claim when they serve one. Contesting jurisdiction involves an application and £100 fee to the court that you would be asking the court to order to be paid by the Claimant, or suing VCS for your loss. It is likely to stop the claim in its tracks, we believe, from UKPPO Airport cases we've seen here.

If it were me I would write to VCS now and tell them the above (and that you were an employee, if you like) but the main thing is to tell them that if they try a claim you WILL contest jurisdiction and that this letter serves as fair warning that by proceeding to court they accept the £100 charge you will be seeking for the court to order that VCS refund.

Fruitcake

First, find the PoFA 2012 online. There is a link in the NEWBIES or you can use a search engine. You need to look at Schedule 4 of the Act.

From the PoFA: -

1 (1) This Schedule applies where

(a) the driver of a vehicle is required by virtue of a relevant obligation to pay parking charges in respect of the parking of the vehicle on relevant land; …

2 (1) In this Schedule— …

“relevant land” has the meaning given by paragraph 3; …

3 (1) In this Schedule “relevant land” means any land including land above or below ground level) other than—

(a) a highway maintainable at the public expense (within the meaning of section 329(1) of the Highways Act 1980);

(b) a parking place which is provided or controlled by a traffic authority;

(c) any land (not falling within paragraph (a) or (b)) on which the parking of a vehicle is subject to statutory control.

(3) For the purposes of sub-paragraph (1)(c) the parking of a vehicle on land is “subject to statutory control” if any statutory provision imposes a liability (whether criminal or civil, and whether in the form of a fee or charge or a penalty of any kind) in respect of the parking on that land of vehicles generally or of vehicles of a description that includes the vehicle in question.

(4) In sub-paragraph (3) “statutory provision” means any provision (apart from this Schedule) contained in—

(a) any Act (including a local or private Act), whenever passed;

or

(b) any subordinate legislation, whenever made,
and for this purpose “subordinate legislation”

and for this purpose “subordinate legislation” means an Order in Council or any order, regulations, byelaws or other legislative instrument.





This means that any land where byelaws apply is not relevant land as per the PoFA.

Then you use the information from post 3 to show that byelaws apply on this land, therefore the scammers cannot use the PoFA to hold a keeper liable because the alleged event did not occur on relevant land.

Umkomaas

The PPC can issue a charge, but cannot hold the keeper liable on 'not relevant land'.

Fruitcake

Umkomaas wrote: »

The PPC can issue a charge, but cannot hold the keeper liable on 'not relevant land'.

Thanks.

Post edited accordingly.