Buying house with an internal wall removed

darthpaul6

Hi all,

We've had an offer accepted on a house which has had a wall removed at some point. The current owners (of two years) have no information, though our solicitor says they should have received some when they bought it. The building surveyor called out that "It is not possible to determine the exact nature of support provided to the structure above". She advised us to establish whether the alterations met regulations via the solicitor's searches...

There's no record of compliance with Building Regulations through the local authority (there are three other applications since 1991, two approved and one denied). If compliance was undertaken through an Approved Inspector, we have no way of knowing who that was if the info hasn't been passed down.

My understanding is that if it wasn't load-bearing, there's no need for it to comply with building regs, but we've no way to know if it was. This leaves us in a precarious position. If we buy the house and the alteration did need approval, we're on the hook for the LABC Regularisation costs, not to mention the potential structural issues. Our solicitor has suggested an indemnity policy but this wouldn't alter any fundamental structural problems we'd be left with.

We're not even able to verify exactly when the house was built. In the past it's been marketed as Victorian, but the agent on this sale says it's a post-WW2 fill-in. Local authority records only seem to go back to 1974, so I'm trying every avenue I can think of to find some kind of history for the place.

Right now we're thinking our only recourse is to consult a Structural Engineer for an expert opinion, but we're first time buyers and are conscious that we're probably missing something(s).

Does anyone have any advice as to how to proceed, please? Thanks in advance.

jimbog

Do you have a Rightmove link? Copy and paste it without the 'www' and put some spaces in

davidmcn

Surely your surveyor has a clue as to how old the house is at least? Things like old maps (or the title deeds) will often give a good indication.

Did the surveyor really have no idea about the likely age of the alteration? Often things like age of the decor etc provide some hints.

Structurally, up to your surveyor to advise on whether there are any issues and whether they recommend a structural engineer (do they?). In practice, the council aren't going to knock on the door asking you to fix anything, so the indemnity policy is there to cover the almost non-existent risk of it happening.

And in general, this happens all the time and your solicitor should be advising you on how to proceed.

PensionNs

If you commissioned a full buildings survey (as opposed to a Homebuyers), I'm surprised the surveyor couldn't tell.

Do the neighbours have identical houses? They might have an idea whether the said wall was load-bearing or not..

Silvertabby

Are there similar houses in nearby? I doubt that all will have had this same wall removed, so hopefully a nice (new) neighbour will let you see if it's load bearing or not.

Crossed with PensionNs !

AndyTails

I'm assuming the wall was on the ground floor of a two-storey property? Go and jump on the floor upstairs above where the wall used to be.

If you fall through - it was a structural wall.

If you don't get much vibration, and the ceiling on the ground floor doesn't crack - it probably wasn't a structural wall.

To be honest, if the wall was removed a few years ago and your surveyor didn't note any signs of distress, it's unlikely to have been structural.

Doozergirl

If it was through an approved inspector, it would have been registered with the local authority, still.

I'm not sure why the age of the house is relevant but there's usually a massive difference between the look of a Victorian property and one built after WW2.

Can tell to a certain degree if it's likely to be load bearing by looking at the floor plan and what's actually there. You're limited to 'definitely' and 'maybe' though - it's hard to rule it out.

darthpaul6

Thank you all for your thoughts on this.

It's transpired that the Surveyor was talking about a completely different part of the house which seems as though it did receive approval back in '93 when a single story extension was added. There's no wall between the living room and the entrance hall so we had assumed this was the wall the surveyor was referring to.
I think it's odd that she hasn't been able (or willing) to determine the age of the house. She seems to have taken the Estate Agent's account of it as late 1940s as gospel. I'm having to make my own enquiries with the Council, who seem willing to help.

It's not of a piece with the houses either side (different colour brick, different height, roof pitch etc.), which lends some circumstantial credence to the post-war fill-in story... But that could easily be the Estate Agent's assumption presented as fact. As I mentioned, it's previously been marketed as Victorian and I wouldn't know much difference.

Even though it seems this particular problwm wasn't such an issue after all, I'd just like to know as much as we can given the survey has highlighted quite a few other issues (high damp readings via Protimeter, etc.)

Gloriwulf

Try your local record office for pre-74 local authority records, as many councils have off-loaded these records to the archives. You can find building control plans and similar at many of the county record offices. Also check early OS maps as you may be able to tell roughly when your plot stops showing up as empty. Depending on where you are in the country, you may also find 1940s aerial photographs.

tasticz

Can you show us the floor plan and highlight the wall you are referring to. I will give you my opinion if you provide this

darthpaul6

Gloriwulf wrote: »

Try your local record office for pre-74 local authority records, as many councils have off-loaded these records to the archives. You can find building control plans and similar at many of the county record offices. Also check early OS maps as you may be able to tell roughly when your plot stops showing up as empty. Depending on where you are in the country, you may also find 1940s aerial photographs.

I'm on it right now! Council seem able/willing to help but it'll be 5-10 working days, and I've no idea what kind of info to expect.
I'll look into the maps, but I've been able to find clear mentions of people living at the address during the late 1800s, so it was definitely there then.