PIP tribunal and evidence (or lack of).

CakeCrusader

Hi.



My adult kid suffers with anxiety and depression, they are also dyspraxic, have hypermobility syndrome and a social communication disorder. They were in receipt of PIP for 4 years but this was stopped after their recent reassessment even though their condition has worsened (they now have depression), they can't cook as their anxiety prevents this and they struggle to use knives due to their bendy hands, they need a lot of support to leave the house, they can't walk very far as the hyper mobility affects their ankles and feet, struggle to put on clothes as they can't manage buttons or tie shoe laces, can't plan a journey or follow any sort of direction.


We asked for a mandatory reconsideration as they awarded my kid 0 points for everything, totally ignoring everything we wrote on the form and said in the assessment, and the PIP claim was refused, so now we're going to a tribunal. The issue is the lack of evidence. They did see a physio about 6 years ago, the physio discharged them as there was nothing they could do. They see the GP for medication check ups but that's about it (I will ask the GP). We don't get any help, I do everything. I'm not sure what else I can use, can anyone help, please?


Many thanks!

berkshiregaz

I would use this time to get some upto date evidence. Ask the GP to either give you a report or refer you back to physio so they can make a fresh opinion, which would be key evidence for you.
What a nightmare bloody system we fight!

CakeCrusader

berkshiregaz wrote: »

I would use this time to get some upto date evidence. Ask the GP to either give you a report or refer you back to physio so they can make a fresh opinion, which would be key evidence for you.
What a nightmare bloody system we fight!

Thank you. I'll pop to the GP tomorrow and ask about a letter. We weren't sent a discharge summary from the physio so I might get in touch with PALS to ask. CAHMS refused to see my kid so I may as well ask for that too, it's not as if we haven't tried to get support! We've seen about 4 different physio's, none of them could help, unfortunately. It's a nightmare of a system, I don't know how people cope. Life's already difficult for a disabled person but it's made a thousand times harder when the DWP pull stunts like this.

swingaloo

As he received no points at all I would work out where you think he should have been awarded points and concentrate on those areas.


Don't forget, its not the actual condition that he suffers from that matters, its about the help he needs to manage which is how the points are awarded.

CakeCrusader

swingaloo wrote: »

As he received no points at all I would work out where you think he should have been awarded points and concentrate on those areas.


Don't forget, its not the actual condition that he suffers from that matters, its about the help he needs to manage which is how the points are awarded.

Thank you, 95% of the letter's nonsense "You can engage with other people unaided - 0" he rarely leaves the house and stammers when he does because he's so anxious. I've focused on the points that are wrong and I've said why. I'll write a daily diary as they need help with pretty much everything. We've tried asking for support so many times and there's been nothing, we've just been left to cope.

calcotti

If you have sought help but been unable to get it I think it is worth mentioning this. Although it is not directly relevant to the point scoring it may help avoid the ridiculous situation where it is concluded that nothing is wrong because no help is being provided.

CakeCrusader

calcotti wrote: »

If you have sought help but been unable to get it I think it is worth mentioning this. Although it is not directly relevant to the point scoring it may help avoid the ridiculous situation where it is concluded that nothing is wrong because no help is being provided.

I did during the assessment, again in the mandatory consideration and again on the tribunal form. We have asked over and over again, no one's helped though so I do everything. The system's messed up!

poppy12345

It's really important to know that mentioning any lies or contradictions in the report to HMCTS isn't going to help his claim because they won't be interested in any of that.


What they will be interested in is where you think her should have score those points and your reasons why. Adding some real life examples of what happened the last time he attempted that activity for each descriptor that applies to him will also help.


Write a diary, ask someone that knows him well to write a supporting letter. Request his medical record from his GP to see if there's anything in there you can use, it's free to receive digital copies.


Tribunal waiting lists are huge in a lot of areas across the country and some are waiting about a year for a hearing date so you'll have plenty of time to send anything that needs to be sent.

CakeCrusader

poppy12345 wrote: »

It's really important to know that mentioning any lies or contradictions in the report to HMCTS isn't going to help his claim because they won't be interested in any of that.


What they will be interested in is where you think her should have score those points and your reasons why. Adding some real life examples of what happened the last time he attempted that activity for each descriptor that applies to him will also help.


Write a diary, ask someone that knows him well to write a supporting letter. Request his medical record from his GP to see if there's anything in there you can use, it's free to receive digital copies.


Tribunal waiting lists are huge in a lot of areas across the country and some are waiting about a year for a hearing date so you'll have plenty of time to send anything that needs to be sent.

I've written about each point in turn what he needs help with (can't cook a basic meal) and why (dyspraxia and hypermobility make using a knife unsafe, he also gets anxious) and that we disagree with the points awarded, is this OK? I'm a little worried now. I'll write a diary, he doesn't see anyone other than the GP though, he rarely leaves the house. He might have kittens when I tell him about the wait, he hadn't thought of that. At least he's got me to pay the bills and feed him, I've no idea how others cope.



Thank you all so much!!

Alice_Holt

it's likely the DWP evidence bundle will help. As this is likely to include past PIP assessments when the award was given. Together with the PIP2 / AR1 forms.

Also the verbal evidence of your child at the tribunal will be very important - this is vital evidence for the tribunal panel.

As poppy said - your child can get a copy of their medical records. They can then select a relevant period, and provide this together with a summary for the Tribunal Service (TS) referring to specific entries which support their case. (Note that the TS will want to see the complete records not a redacted copy).

Your evidence as their carer will also be important - write a formal letter to the tribunal explaining what you / other family members do for your child and how this relates to the PIP descriptors / points.

Don't be too concerned about the lack of medical letters etc.

Wait till your child gets the DWP evidence bundle to write a submission to send to the tribunal in support of thier appeal. In the meantime:
a) see if your child can get help with the appeal from their local advice agency / CAB:
https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/about-us/contact-us/contact-us/contact-us/#h-find-your-nearest-citizens-advice

b) both familiarise yourselves with the PIP criteria and points system:
https://www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/personal-independence-payment-pip/pip-points-system
https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/808855/pip-assessment-guide-part-2-the-assessment-criteria.pdf

c) Write a diary of care needs relating to the PIP points:
https://www.advicenow.org.uk/guides/how-win-pip-appeal
(This guide has info on how to write a statement / submission).

This is the form you need to lodge the appeal:
https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/748554/sscs1-eng.pdf

Are you their rep for the appeal or their appointee?

CakeCrusader

Alice_Holt wrote: »

it's likely the DWP evidence bundle will help. As this is likely to include past PIP assessments when the award was given. Together with the PIP2 / AR1 forms.

Also the verbal evidence of your child at the tribunal will be very important - this is vital evidence for the tribunal panel.

As poppy said - your child can get a copy of their medical records. They can then select a relevant period, and provide this together with a summary for the Tribunal Service (TS) referring to specific entries which support their case. (Note that the TS will want to see the complete records not a redacted copy).

Your evidence as their carer will also be important - write a formal letter to the tribunal explaining what you / other family members do for your child and how this relates to the PIP descriptors / points.

Don't be too concerned about the lack of medical letters etc.

Wait till your child gets the DWP evidence bundle to write a submission to send to the tribunal in support of thier appeal. In the meantime:
a) see if your child can get help with the appeal from their local advice agency / CAB:
https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/about-us/contact-us/contact-us/contact-us/#h-find-your-nearest-citizens-advice

b) both familiarise yourselves with the PIP criteria and points system:
https://www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/personal-independence-payment-pip/pip-points-system
https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/808855/pip-assessment-guide-part-2-the-assessment-criteria.pdf

c) Write a diary of care needs relating to the PIP points:
https://www.advicenow.org.uk/guides/how-win-pip-appeal
(This guide has info on how to write a statement / submission).

This is the form you need to lodge the appeal:
https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/748554/sscs1-eng.pdf

Are you their rep for the appeal or their appointee?

This is massively helpful, thank you so much! I'm his rep (he's ticked the rep box and filled in my details). I've already checked the points and the criteria, I'm not sure he'll go to the CAB, he gets anxious so it may be difficult, but I'll ask. I lodged the appeal online and I'll follow your guidance above.