How do you cope with tenants or lodgers?

snilloct1957

Hi bobwilson,

I read your previous post about how to get rid of problematic lodgers, so I know where you're coming from, being a LL myself. It appears that some lodgers may have adopted you as their replacement parent now that they've moved out of the family home. They generally have failed to grasp the significance or purpose of a wardrobe and a chest of drawers, and expect their clothes to magically transport themselves into these items,
as they did at home.

Similarly, a clean kitchen is the result of the dust fairies who visit it every night to wash the dishes, wipe down surfaces and clean the cooker. This may be their first or second time away from the nest, and they are failing to respond to the conventions of social living because it has never dawned on them up to now.

In order to separate the wheat from the chaff, you need to get a reference from their parents as to their suitability as a lodger. Plus certain conditions need to be written into the lodger agreement regarding cleaning, noise and general behaviour in the presence of others that leaves no ambiguity or wriggle room.

I wish you luck in your future endeavours.

PS Just realised my mistake. Any parent is going to give their offspring a glowing reference in order to get them out of the house and a chance to defumigate their room.

snilloct1957

To murphybear. " I live in an over 60s independent living community of 33 properties. I have seen inside at least 20 of them and every single one, without exception, is clean and tidy."

I would suggest that these people are mature persons of a certain age who have learnt the basic skills of household management, whereas the OP's lodgers are of the ilk who don't know one end of a sweeping brush from the other.

AdrianC

bobwilson wrote: »

Considering how almost all tenants want everything for nothing as in the above, how do you manage it & make it worth your time without turning it into a not-for-profit charity?

Who ever promised you this would be automatically profitable?
Sometimes, you need to sit back, look at the sums, and wonder whether it is worth your time and effort or not - especially if you miscalculated the basic yield of the property before embarking on the business.

Comms69

bobwilson wrote: »

Tenants always want a clean place to live. They never want to clean up after themselves, but they also never want to pay for a cleaner. - You're picking the wrong kinds of tenants. If you don't hire a cleaner, it becomes impossible to live (in the case of live-in landlords), or impossible to rent out a room when a tenant leaves (in the case of live out landlords). - perhaps if you rented the whole property, instead of by the room, you may find you get people who care. But hey profits come first So, if you offer the place without a cleaner, no one wants to rent it. If you offer the place with a cleaner, they don't want to pay the bill. - if you're renting by the room, you can afford the cleaner If you increase the rental price to accommodate for the cleaner, they don't want to rent it. If you offer them the choice of "pay for a cleaner or clean up after yourself", they always opt for the latter, but then never do it, which makes it impossible to find new tenants for other rooms. If you try to enforce it, they give you attitude & move out, then the cycle repeats with someone else. - Enforce what? It's none of your business how tenants live. Don't like it, YOU do something about it

They seem to have this idea in their heads that any money they pay for bills goes to you. Because they literally pay it to you, it's hard for them to accept that you don't actually receive it. They don't understand that if an electricity bill is £50, that doesn't go to you, it goes to the electricity company. It's like these invisible things aren't "real" for them. - because you're liabilities are not their concern...

If you reduce the rent & include bills & cleaning to a point where someone is willing to rent the room(s), the rent doesn't cover costs. - nonsense.

If you're wealthy enough to be able to offer to pay for their bills and cleaning yourself, even though it makes a huge loss, tenants aren't grateful and consider it your job to do so, as if you're their parent. - stop renting out individual rooms in that case

If you offer bills included, they take advantage (e.g. windows open with heating on full 24/7, or air conditioner unit and server unit in room on 24/7). If you enforce rules, they break rules or you have to ask them to leave - you do that? risk being arrested? & cycle repeats with someone else. If you don't offer bills included, they don't want to rent it in the first place. If you reduce the rent, the property doesn't make ends meet.

I may not be putting it in a concise way, but hope you get the jist.

My question is two-fold:

Considering how almost all tenants want everything for nothing as in the above, how do you manage it & make it worth your time without turning it into a not-for-profit charity?

What makes the majority of tenants or lodgers behave in this self-entitled way? Non-lodgers seem to understand they have to pay their bills & clean up after themselves. Are lodgers a different breed of humanity with "self-entitled / spoilt" DNA profiles, or does something about the "paying rent for a room" process enact a "spoilt" marker in the DNA of most human beings?

When I was a lodger myself, I understood that my landlord was relying on my rent & splitting the bills to make ends meet. I didn't behave like he was the root of all evil or that he should pay for me, so I don't understand this attitude that houses are free & it's all pure profit for landlords. Houses aren't free. Energy & bills aren't free.

You're letting by the room, you're making a profit

grumiofoundation

Comms69 wrote: »

You're letting by the room, you're making a profit

Apparently it is not possible to be a landlord and make a monthly profit.

That reminds me I need to contact my landlord to check they are making enough money and see if they need me to pay them more.

AdrianC

bobwilson wrote: »

Elinore wrote:

Yesterday my snippy, aggressive and shouty co-worker, after slamming down the phone on a caller, said to me she just gets the vilest people on the phone - all day every day - whereas all my customers seem so lovely - I looked her in the eye and asked why she thought that was and she shrugged and said the luck of the draw.

None so blind as those that will not see.

Well now, so you're basically saying I'm snippy, aggressive, shouty, and I attract this behaviour from my lodgers. Thanks for that! The fact you get lovely phone calls proves it Wonderful.

Actually, I read Elinore as saying that their coworker's attitude was echoed by the customer.

And I'm not altogether sure you didn't just give a fine demo...

bobwilson

Kentish_Dave wrote: »

It sounds like you must have made some pretty terrible decisions in your life, yet are determined to keep doing so. You seem utterly miserable, yet will not downsize as you will “lose capital.”

if your house has dropped in value that capital has already gone, and your insistence that your way is the right one makes little sense. Your way has brought you here. The people pointing it better options have generally made better decisions. Going with your judgement over theirs is just weird.

How do you know any of this? You're judging someone based on pure speculation :rotfl: MSE forum is on fire today!

You know nothing about the decisions of my life or how successful they were- or wether I went by other peoples judgement or not. :cool:

bobwilson

steampowered wrote: »

It isn't your tenants' fault that your business model sucks.

Assuming I have a business model implies the situation was intentional! Thanks for your constructive criticism, steampowered Really productive :rotfl:

Yalpsmol

How did you unintentionally find and charge people to live with you?
Get rid of them on purpose.

bobwilson

snilloct1957 wrote: »

Hi bobwilson,

I read your previous post about how to get rid of problematic lodgers, so I know where you're coming from, being a LL myself. It appears that some lodgers may have adopted you as their replacement parent now that they've moved out of the family home. They generally have failed to grasp the significance or purpose of a wardrobe and a chest of drawers, and expect their clothes to magically transport themselves into these items,
as they did at home.

Similarly, a clean kitchen is the result of the dust fairies who visit it every night to wash the dishes, wipe down surfaces and clean the cooker. This may be their first or second time away from the nest, and they are failing to respond to the conventions of social living because it has never dawned on them up to now.

In order to separate the wheat from the chaff, you need to get a reference from their parents as to their suitability as a lodger. Plus certain conditions need to be written into the lodger agreement regarding cleaning, noise and general behaviour in the presence of others that leaves no ambiguity or wriggle room.

I wish you luck in your future endeavours.

PS Just realised my mistake. Any parent is going to give their offspring a glowing reference in order to get them out of the house and a chance to defumigate their room.

snilloct1957, thank you for your voice of reason! I was beginning to believe all the other posts on here that I'm somehow a delusional being who needs to be arrested for asking a lodger in my home to leave. You are of course completely correct in your assessment- many are exactly as you describe, but talking about it with them results in denial & their parents (or indeed anyone else) will always give glowing references in desperation to get them to leave. The only saving grace is that I'm getting a little better at spotting them. My success rate is still only about 30% though. Normal lodgers are in short supply around here. In one of the latest applications, it was the mother trying to find accommodation for her 20 year old son who "doesn't have time" to do it himself! :rotfl: I explained to her that I'm looking for someone who knows how to share a home, clean up after themselves & share household tasks like the rest of us, as opposed to someone who has had everything done for them in the past. She politely but honestly recognised that her son wouldn't be a good fit ! :rotfl::T:A