Possible Joint Water Supply?

Exodi

Howdy MSE,

I'm currently going through the purchase of a house, we have a mortgage agreed and are over two months into the process. I was advised about a month ago that the water & drainage search provider is unable locate an account and is therefore having trouble providing the search.

As a bit of background (and it becomes relevant), the seller and owner of the property, let's call her Mrs Mum, has had no involvement with the property but instead gave her son, Mr Son, the money to build the property on the agreement that she would own it. Mr Son was married to Mrs Daughter-In-Law and lived in the house with her for around 10 years until he tragically passed away. Mrs Mum eventually decided to sell the house after Mr Son's death and Mrs Daughter-In-Law had to move out. Mrs Daughter-In-Law actually owned and rented a house just behind this property and so moved back there. This may also answer how planning permission was granted to build the house.

So back to the current situation, the search provider hasn't been able to locate an account so I had a viewing with the estate agent to measure up and to try and find the water reference meter (the plan was to provide the details of this to help the search provider find an account). Well me and the estate agent looked high and low for this water meter, and whilst we could find all the neighbours, could not find one for our property for love nor money.

I called up the water board who informed me that there is no account registered at that address. When I enquired how it would have had a water supply for 10+ years they suggested that it may have a joint water supply with another house.

So putting 2 & 2 together; we have a house with no water meter, of which the previous tenants live behind = it would seem most likely the house has a joint water supply with Mrs-Daughter-In Law's house (though upon being quizzed by solicitors, doesn't seem to be aware this is the case? I'd imagine as Mr Son built the house she had had little involvement with the specifics.

So fast forward to today, one month on since the water issue has been raised and no further forward. I'd greatly appreciate any advice in where I go from here?

a) Would I then perform a water & drainage search on Mrs Daughter-In-Law's property? This doesn't sound right?
b) Would I demand that the seller has the supply severed and each house has it's own separate supply? Would this cost the seller? I'm cautious to make such demands when we're already quite far into the process... but then, surely the seller would run against this issue with any buyer?
c) What delay do you see being caused by such an issue? I don't know anything about water supplies so presumably they'd have to take up the ground and lay new pipework?
d) Are there any other possibilities other than a joint supply? Naturally as I'm not the owner I cannot even instruct the water board come out to check the status?

I'm then also aware of the relationships of the Mrs Mum and Mrs Daughter-In-Law. Should it come to light that the house does have a joint supply and Mrs Daughter-In-Law has been paying for water for X time since she moved out, there's a difficult conversation there - this is of no relevance to me though but I worry about upsetting our potential neighbour before we even move in!

Any help greatly appreciated. Trying to be pro-active on the matter as this has sat with my solicitor for over a month now with the only updates being 'we've asked the water search provider to look again"

G_M

Option 1
Buy the property and benefit from free water supply (and sewerage?) until an issue arises.

Risk is that supply could be cut off (ie if it comes off the other property and they turn the tap/cut the pipe.........)

Option 2
Identify the water supply (and serwage) source/pipelines, and get a Deed drawn up between the two properties, granting right to water supply/serwerage over the other property's land, such that you have an ongoing legal right to supply. Might involve a meter too. Register the Deed against both property Titles.


Option 3
Get seller to apply for a new, separate supply direct from the water company, and by-pass the neighbour.

Only option 1 is quick!

Exodi

G_M wrote: »

Option 1
Buy the property and benefit from free water supply (and sewerage?) until an issue arises.

Risk is that supply could be cut off (ie if it comes off the other property and they turn the tap/cut the pipe.........)

Option 2
Identify the water supply (and serwage) source/pipelines, and get a Deed drawn up between the two properties, granting right to water supply/serwerage over the other property's land, such that you have an ongoing legal right to supply. Might involve a meter too. Register the Deed against both property Titles.


Option 3
Get seller to apply for a new, separate supply direct from the water company, and by-pass the neighbour.

Only option 1 is quick!

Hi G_M, thanks for your reply.

I hadn't considered option 2 but option 3 looks like the most sensible way to proceed. It's a bit of a stretch but I wonder if the seller would incur costs for this and what time frames I'd be looking at?

I'm beginning to become more receptive to the fact that this issue may take months to resolve...

xylophone

I wouldn't buy the property unless and until the question was resolved.

Mrs DIL and husband occupied the property for ten years.

There does not seem to be any indication that there is bad blood between MIL (owner) and DIL (ex tenant).

Surely MIL asks DIL how she and husband paid the water bill?

If they were paying the bill for the property DIL owned (and what happened to this property while she wasn't living in it?) and MIL's property on the same account, then presumably DIL knows that this is the case?

Exodi

xylophone wrote: »

I wouldn't buy the property unless and until the question was resolved.

Mrs DIL and husband occupied the property for ten years.

There does not seem to be any indication that there is bad blood between MIL (owner) and DIL (ex tenant).

Surely MIL asks DIL how she and husband paid the water bill?

If they were paying the bill for the property DIL owned (and what happened to this property while she wasn't living in it?) and MIL's property on the same account, then presumably DIL knows that this is the case?

Yeah, I wouldn't plan on exchanging until this was rectified. Correct Mrs DIL & Mr Son occupied the property for 10 years. There doesn't seem to be any indication of bad blood however the situation (being kicked our after DIL's husband died) means it's a possibility.

DIL actually uses the same solicitors (albeit for a completely unrelated affair and I wasn't aware of this until recently) so has been asked regarding the water situation - as above, the DIL seems to be completely oblivious to the water situation. I've naturally got my suspicions on this but am somewhat limited in enquiries being that Mrs DIL isn't the seller. It has crossed my mind she may be deliberately being vague.

The 'other' property was rented whilst DIL wasn't living in it.

I know this is really the sellers issue however this is 1+ month of no update on the water situation and my solicitor only seems to be interested in making re-re-re-enquiries to the search provider.

DigForVictory

Dad's got this on his welsh hideyhole & sorting it has been Taking Months. As in over 36 so far. The estate agent took it off the market as soon as the parking issue was flagged & we haven't tried to find a buyer til we have that & the water sorted & even then there will probably be unexpected little quirks.

How quickly did you want to move? Or is this the right place, you just (reasonably!) want the details sorting first?

That said if you get on with the vendor & are happy to get your water supply sorted once you've moved in, you may manage to lay the ghost of Mr Son & find you have a bonus additional family you weren't quite expecting.

Best of luck!

G_M

Exodi wrote: »

......option 3 looks like the most sensible way to proceed. It's a bit of a stretch but I wonder if the seller would incur costs for this and what time frames I'd be looking at?

I'm beginning to become more receptive to the fact that this issue may take months to resolve...

Yes there'd be costs. Depends how near the mains the property is.


Could take months.

xylophone

The 'other' property was rented whilst DIL wasn't living in it.

Then were the tenants unwittingly paying DIL and husband's bill?

One assumes not, because if this were the case, DIL would now be extremely anxious not to be paying the water bill of MIL's property?

Of course, if the occupant of MIL's house will be paying the water bills for DIL's property, she might not be quite so anxious.....

Exodi

xylophone wrote: »

Then were the tenants unwittingly paying DIL and husband's bill?

One assumes not, because if this were the case, DIL would now be extremely anxious not to be paying the water bill of MIL's property?

Of course, if the occupant of MIL's house will be paying the water bills for DIL's property, she might not be quite so anxious.....

It's something I've also pondered. Perhaps there was a 'bills included' agreement or as you've said, the tenants were unwittingly paying the water bill for both houses. I doubt I'll ever know but I guess it's immaterial.

But then the DIL seems to be completely oblivious to the water situation! Early on my solicitor first requested a water bill for the address, of which they said they didn't have one and just Thursday last week, I was outside the property in which a neighbour asked about what I was doing, ended up calling DIL (that's how I found out she lives behind the property) to which she stated she had no idea where the water meter was. She sounds genuinely unaware - coupled with the fact she's not tripping over herself to rectify this (as I could just move in and have them pay water)

DigForVictory wrote: »

Dad's got this on his welsh hideyhole & sorting it has been Taking Months. As in over 36 so far.

:eek::eek::eek:

xylophone

The fact she's not tripping over herself to rectify this though (as I could just move in and have them pay water) does suggest she's genuinely unaware.

Has a bill never been raised for either property......?

eddddy

Exodi wrote: »

I'd imagine as Mr Son built the house she had had little involvement with the specifics.

Is the son an experienced and reputable builder - or more of a novice 'self-builder'?

It sounds like the son may have done a bit of a 'cowboy botch' on the water supply.

Exodi wrote: »

...lived in the house with her for around 10 years...

So they've waited 10 years before selling. Is it coincidence that after 10 years, mortgage lenders stop asking about new build warranties?

A new build warranty would be an indication that the house was originally built to a good standard. Did this house ever have a warranty?


I think I'd be extra cautious about buying a self-build in these circumstances. At the very least, I think I'd get a full structural survey.