£100 PCN for 4 mins

brightondave

Hi. In a nutshell I needed to call into my Co op local and all 15 bays were taken. I parked in an area which was unmarked. No yellow lines or chevrons. I was away after 4 mins.
Ten days later I get a PCN for £100 or £60 if paid within two weeks.
It was all recorded by a discreet dome camera and they asked me to check the t+cs of the signs.
On entrance it mentions a max 2 hour stay.
The other signs which measure 45cm square mentions in little writing that you should park within the bays allotted.
I appealed on the basis of the 10 mins grace period which they rejected saying the grace period is just for the motorist to read the t+cs not to wait, idle or use the facilities?
They have photographic evidence of me with a box of tea bags in my hand.
So apart from them recommending the Popla appeals procedure and then forfeiting my right to
pay the lower amount.
So in a nutshell is that me banged to rights?
Your thoughts please.

onlyfoolsandparking

Who is the parking company that is trying to scam you?

brightondave

One Parking Solution in west sussex

LoneStarState

Have you thought about a passionate complaint to the Co-op (complain to the top to kick the hornet's nest or alternatively if you know and are affable with the manager of that particular store try there also)?

You could talk about your shock, confusion and later disgust at this spurious PCN. You might want to state that you parked as considerately as you could given the parking conditions available to you i.e. no available spaces for a genuine customer who wanted to part with their cash at their store. You did buy something (the aforementioned tea) correct? Prove your patronage with receipt/cc statement. Mention that if this isn't cancelled, you will cancel your relationship with the business as a consumer (could be good to mention negative feedback online for the store based on this experience also).

I suspect the lack of any double yellow lines/hatched markings is a deliberate ruse so that motorists would think they can quickly stop there to pick something up and lo and behold the PPC eyes turn to dollar signs.

It would be best to read the Newbies thread where you can see an array of well crafted appeal points to help you with POPLA.

brightondave

Been there done that. He said hes had so many customers get caught out like that.
Its because the landlord brought in the parking company and he didn't even tell them he was doing it, he must be on a right rake off?

beamerguy

brightondave wrote: »

Been there done that. He said hes had so many customers get caught out like that.
Its because the landlord brought in the parking company and he didn't even tell them he was doing it, he must be on a right rake off?

QUESTION..... you received the ticket in 10 days in the post ... is that correct ....... who took the picture of you ?

onlyfoolsandparking

Then you need to complain to the top (CEO or similar) as many store managers either cant be bothered or genuinely don't have the power to cancel these scamvoices.


Also you need to find out (probably on this forum) as much as possible on what the chances are of one parking scammer solutions taking you to Court and how others have defeated them.


Some parking scammers are more litigious (nasty) than others, find out who your up against. The more experienced regulars will know more about this particular scammer and you do yourself a big favour by reading as much as possible on here to avoid schoolboy errors on how you take matters forward.

Coupon-mad

So apart from them recommending the Popla appeals procedure and then forfeiting my right to pay the lower amount.
So in a nutshell is that me banged to rights?

Errm, no.

Is this that usual cash cow, site, the Peacehaven South Coast road with the loading bay? If you were in the loading bay, then you appeal to POPLA that you were unloading something in those 4 minutes...I am local and have a pre-written one or two I've done for Brighton people. OPS don't like this sort of appeal, and usually fold!

brightondave

beamerguy wrote: »

QUESTION..... you received the ticket in 10 days in the post ... is that correct ....... who took the picture of you ?

Yes about 10 days
They have one of those lamp post head type with a black dome underneath. When you go onto their system there are about 10 colour pics of me from arriving to going.

brightondave

Coupon-mad wrote: »

Errm, no.

Is this that usual cash cow, site, the Peacehaven South Coast road with the loading bay? If you were in the loading bay, then you appeal to POPLA that you were unloading something in those 4 minutes...I am local and have a pre-written one or two I've done for Brighton people. OPS don't like this sort of appeal, and usually fold!

Yes that's the one. Only popped by for some teabags but all bays were taken. Wasn't on loading bay but parked on top right outside Costa. Time taken 4 mins from start to finish.

family4tunes

brightondave wrote: »

Hi. In a nutshell I needed to call into my Co op local and all 15 bays were taken. I parked in an area which was unmarked. No yellow lines or chevrons. I was away after 4 mins.
Ten days later I get a PCN for £100 or £60 if paid within two weeks.
It was all recorded by a discreet dome camera and they asked me to check the t+cs of the signs.
On entrance it mentions a max 2 hour stay.
The other signs which measure 45cm square mentions in little writing that you should park within the bays allotted.
I appealed on the basis of the 10 mins grace period which they rejected saying the grace period is just for the motorist to read the t+cs not to wait, idle or use the facilities?
They have photographic evidence of me with a box of tea bags in my hand.
So apart from them recommending the Popla appeals procedure and then forfeiting my right to
pay the lower amount.
So in a nutshell is that me banged to rights?
Your thoughts please.

Private companies can issue parking notices and may call them (PCN) Parking Charge Notices, but they are not the same as the (PCN) Penalty Charge Notice issued by the local councils and Police.

They are not backed up by government law. Instead, they are business invoices for a breach of contract. If the car park operator wants to force you to pay, they will need to take you to the county or civil court, which is costly and time-consuming (and rarely done).

If the car park operator takes you to court and wins, you then have pay the costs in addition to the original charge (these can only be proportionate & similar to local councils). Only if you lose and still refuse to pay, you could find the judgment going on to your credit file as a CCJ (county court judgement - removed after 6 years).

Check out the BPA (British Parking Association) and their (COP) codes of practice a private company have to obey to be lawful. If you find through your own experience they have failed on one of these polices then use this to appeal upon. Don’t forget, the PCN you received is an invoice not a fine. They can only take you to county court for failing to pay an invoice nothing else (If they ever do, as its costly for them).

Most private parking companies just send out their letters and invoices in the hope you will pay. They mark them with red borders and chequered edges to give the impression they are authorities in an attempt to make you believe you are done for. They also up the costs etc each time or offer quick reduced settlements. They prey on the majority of motorists paying within the first few contacts using these tactics.

If you totally ignore their letters and hang out without paying owt, then after around a year they will pass the bill over to another collection company who will try their luck getting something from you. Same tactics will apply with the new company, and when unsuccessful (If continually ignored) they will pass on the bill to another and so on and so on.

This is based upon my own personal experience, relatives and friends. All of which ignored everything ever sent by the initial private parking company and the others which brought the bill from them. In all cases we never responded to any mailings and remain happily blissful we didn’t chuck our money away to these robbing cowboys.

BPO PDF file link:

https://www.britishparking.co.uk/write/BPA_AOS_CODE_OF_PRACTICE_CURRENT.pdf

NB: Might get a letter once a year making the same threats etc but is quickly binned after a quick chuckle. a slight hindrance to my normal daily affairs for that day. I bin more letterbox flyers which annoy me more than theirs. After a few year I've noticed the earlier PCN's (parking charge NOTICES) have stopped altogether, Ya!