Parking overstay PCN. POPLA appeal refused, do I continue?

The_Napper

Just as an update for future reference.

I have sent a letter of complaint (via email) to POPLA regarding what I see as a procedural error, a breach of conduct and a serious lack of professionalism regarding their assessment of my appeal.

I won't go into specifics and looking at other posts I doubt my complaint will be given any serious consideration but I think it worthwhile doing as a matter of principle.

Can anyone advise if apart from my MP and WHICH? (I am presently preparing correspondence to send to the latter and preparing for an appointment with for the former), are there any other bodies that it is worth complaining to to register complaints to about POPLA?

Coupon-mad

Well POPLA FAQs say:

POPLA has been administered by Ombudsman Services since 1 October 2015, following our appointment from the British Parking Association (BPA). Ombudsman Services is approved by organisations such as Chartered Trading Standards Institute, Ofcom, and Ofgem as a certified Alternative Dispute Resolution provider.

So any of the above, even if they ignore it, should hear why they should not be approving POPLA.

KeithP

Hero878 wrote: »

I suggest just paying them and get it over and done with. I am currently considering paying the £60 before it goes up to £100 as POPLA seems to side with the operators most of the time anyway.

Would be interesting to see what you are basing your assumption on.

Even if it were true, a PoPLA decision is not binding on the motorist.

Umkomaas

Hero878 wrote: »

I suggest just paying them and get it over and done with. I am currently considering paying the £60 before it goes up to £100 as POPLA seems to side with the operators most of the time anyway.

Too late for this case, once it's gone to POPLA, the 'discount' con disappears.

The_Napper

Hero878 wrote: »

I suggest just paying them and get it over and done with. I am currently considering paying the £60 before it goes up to £100 as POPLA seems to side with the operators most of the time anyway.

Thank you for your suggestion Hero878 and in an open forum as this is I believe all plausible suggestions should be considered but as Unkomaas has stated it is now too late for paying the £60. I could of course choose the current easy option which is to pay the £100 and avoid any further strife but I have committed myself to going all the way to court in this matter and am now enjoying the challenge so have no desire to instigate an untimely defeat to this pretentious little soiree.
You are probably correct in your assertation that POPLA reject most appeals but to gain a final victory in a little battle such as this it must be expected to take a few little knocks on the way.
It is of course your own choice if you wish to pay the £60 charge and thus become another victim of these scammers and if you so decide then I wish you you no ill will in your decision.

The_Napper

Coupon-mad wrote: »

Well POPLA FAQs say:

So any of the above, even if they ignore it, should hear why they should not be approving POPLA.

I'm more than happy to highlight the way these PPC's go about their business if it may help in bringing in some form of regulatory control over this malpractice but I am somewhat out of my depth in this so could do with a little more help to ensure I maximise this intention. Are you implying that I register my complaints and concerns to any and all of the bodies you mentioned?
Again, more than happy to do so but Just want to confirm exactly what actions to take to help.

Hero878

KeithP wrote: »

Would be interesting to see what you are basing your assumption on.

Even if it were true, a PoPLA decision is not binding on the motorist.

Umkomaas wrote: »

Too late for this case, once it's gone to POPLA, the 'discount' con disappears.

Guys apologies please ignore what I said. I was just feeling frustrated and was giving in to the charge. Fight it all the way!

The_Napper

nosferatu1001 wrote: »

They will have, of course, your entire appeal trail, and so you cannot contradict yourself or you undermine your credibility.

Nosferatu, your above reply was to an earler query I made when I stated
"My defence is now based on what I believe are legal grounds rather than anything else, this in the hope that anything I have mistakenly said in my POPLA appeal will not jeopardise my defence in court".
I've now had time to look into this. I have no intention of contradicting myself and will hopefully avoid doing so. I don't want to post my full defence statement to POPLA as most of it's ramblings are irrelevant but it is suffice to say it dwelt more on me having some knowledge of some of the car park regulations from previous information gained from the place I was visiting rather than from the car park signage and how this information was somewhat ambiguous. I stated that I took little notice of the car park signage which is true with respect to the one line where it says "These terms apply at al times" (I totally failed to notice this and will hopefully reference the "Red hand rule" with respect to it) as my interest in the signage at the time in question focused on trying to assertain whether or not parking bays were allocated to individual buildings, disabled drivers or staff and thus ensuring I parked in a correctly allocated bay. The claimant in his POPLA defence has basically stated that any and all notices and instructions given by staff in the building are non contractual and are done so at their own discretion. (Not exact wording but certainly to that effect).
My intention is therefore to remove any and all references to information I either knew previously or gained on the date of the incident in question from the place I was visiting and base my defence on the terms and conditions actually posted on the signage.
My concern is based on the fact that in my POPLA appeal I had stated that I had knowledge of certain parking conditions and even though these conditions were not displayed on any of the signage in the car park and even though they were gained from non contractual sources they might try and use this against me, in your experience of these matters, can they do so legally?

The_Napper

The_Napper wrote: »

I'm more than happy to highlight the way these PPC's go about their business if it may help in bringing in some form of regulatory control over this malpractice but I am somewhat out of my depth in this so could do with a little more help to ensure I maximise this intention. Are you implying that I register my complaints and concerns to any and all of the bodies you mentioned?
Again, more than happy to do so but Just want to confirm exactly what actions to take to help.

'COUPON-MAD' Strike the above question, I have done a bit of digging and now realise what you refer to. I'll wait and see if POPLA respond to my complaint and if not will raise it with the "Ombudsman Services". Cheers

The_Napper

Just to update this thread in case I forget things in future:
No reply from POPLA re complaint regarding lack of procedure in their assessment.
Found the true landowner via HM Land Registry, (cost £6 but worth it). They're not based on mainland UK but I sent them a nice long letter explaining how their land is being mis-managed etc and included points from this post and others gleaned from other threads. No reply as yet.
Got some nice witness statements from businesses in the car park area who are not affiliated with car park but get asked about registering details there. Good for future use.
Had a good session with local MP's caseworker who was very helpful and knowledgeable of this ongoing saga and of Sir Greg Knight's bill and stated that the MP she worked for strongly backed the bill. Cross party backing at that. Very glad to hear that one. Also said she'd look into getting PCN cancelled for me.

Also received (5/3/19) first entertaining letter from the PPC saying they will instruct third party collection agents if payment not received in 14 days, costs will escalate followed by legal proceedings, followed by possible options (which maybe available) from a further judgement where bailiffs attend property to seize vehicle/goods, PPC deduct money direct from employer and/or stop me accessing my bank until they get their bit first. Like said all very entertaining and ready for the bin. Probably not so entertaining for some people though?

So, just an update so nothing changed really, still waiting and reading threads and regulations, Cop's and handbooks etc (Probably too much for some peoples liking??).
Thanks for reading.